[members-discuss] [ncc-announce] [GM] Draft RIPE NCC Charging Scheme 2025 Proposals

The point of "ordering the cake" is not applicable. Just ask yourself 
"when was there a vote, on the draft budget"? ...Over the last few years 
at least, i belive there was none.

Did they ask for feedback: Yes, but looking at the feedback from last 
years vote on the fee shedule, and so on, i do belive it was clear wich 
direction the members wanted.

So the argument one could make is that "people where shown a cake with 
no alternative options" and "feedback recieved before the showing did 
not impact the product that was delivered".

Just saying.


I do undestand you feel the need to protect your own interests in this 
disucussion. And based on your writing i see that you are trying find 
new business cases for your LIR ventures.
Wich is all fine. But as shown above the cake argument is week. 
Especially in the context of there being no direct mechanism to 
adopt/reject a budget by vote.


Regards



On 4/12/24 10:16 AM, Tobias Fiebig via members-discuss wrote:
> Moin,
>
> On Fri, 2024-04-12 at 08:48 +0100, Paul Newton wrote:
>> With all the focus on how to apportion costs, I hope we don't lose
>> focus on the total budget. As a small LIR, we are unable to take
>> advantage of the peripheral activities, credits, etc, we just want to
>> register.
> Which is fine.
>
>> By analogy, we can't afford an all-inclusive package holiday, we just
>> want to hire a car!
> You are not _required_ to become an LIR / member. You can always enter
> an agreement with an LIR that they will handle registration services
> for you, holding the registration rights in trust, putting a MNT-BY for
> you on the object, delegating rDNS etcetc. All with a contractual
> agreement in the back that ensures your right to transfer the entrusted
> resources they hold for you elsewhere, while ensuring that the LIR is
> not allowed to sell/rent/use them.
>
> So, if you just want to hire the car/resources, me--and likely a lot of
> other LIRs--would be very happy to provide that service to you. I'd
> even offer to base charging upon an RIR's net charging scheme of your
> choice -20%.
>
> The point of membership is more than just the registration of
> resources, see also ICP-2. This also connects to the point regarding
> 'only three options' just brought forward by Sebastien:
>
> We, the membership, voted for a set of activities; The board now
> presented options to realize the decided upon activities. If we want
> other options for fees, we first need to vote for other activities. We
> did not. Ultimately, the "RIPE bosses" is "us", and the board is tasked
> with somehow realizing what _we_ asked for.
>
> We ordered the cake, we have to pay the cake. The board just sends the
> Tikkie*. Of course, this does not mean that we cannot discuss whether
> it must be the same (expensive) cake next time we go out. But starting
> the discussion after ordering the cake is somewhat difficult.
>
> With best regards,
> Tobias
>
> * In the Netherlands its customary that one person pays the bill when
> going out and then gets reimbursed. Tikkie is a popular system in the
> Netherlands to send/receive money via direct bank transfer, often used
> to share bills in restaurants. Even though other systems now exist, the
> term stuck;
>
>