[members-discuss] [LIR] Re: Fwd: Re: RIPE DB T&C violation by brokers

My stance on this is below.

Why should a private company be allowed to make profit on public IP Space.

Even the UK Government sells its IP Space to private companies for Profit (Public selling Public IP Space to private companies is a JOKE

Remember, IP Space is not owned by the LIR but allocated by Ripe. So how and why is it allowed by a LIR to sell something that is not owned by them?

If a LIR no longer needs IP Space then return it to RIPE. 

This is why IPV4 ran out due to RIPEs poor management policy.

IF I could vote no confidence in the ripe board for allowing such business to take place, I would vote now.

I'll go rent a car park space shall I, be allocated a space and then go sell it for 500x the rent price. 

Members need to step up here and instead of saying this has been discussed before, get on and make this change or the same will happen with IPv6 in years to come.



-----Original Message-----
From: members-discuss [mailto:members-discuss-bounces at ripe.net] On Behalf Of Carlos Friaças via members-discuss
Sent: 27 November 2019 23:44
To: Patrick Velder <lists at velder.li>
Cc: members-discuss at ripe.net
Subject: Re: [members-discuss] [LIR] Re: Fwd: Re: RIPE DB T&C violation by brokers



Hi,

I don't understand RIPE NCC's actions as "support", instead i see it as simple "acknowledgement".

And in case you haven't noticed, "They" are also RIPE NCC members, some even several times... :-)

Cheers,
Carlos



On Wed, 27 Nov 2019, Patrick Velder wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I see no reasons why there should be "RIPE certified brokers" or similar.
> They are making profit with "selling" public resources. That's a 
> business which should not be supported by RIPE.
>
> Best regards
>
> On 27.11.19 14:45, Maxemilian Hilbrand wrote:
>> Me too.
>> 
>> I got some similar emails within the last few weeks, and I have no 
>> idea if this is fraud or not.
>> 
>> To avoid fraud, it might be a good idea to have an official auction 
>> of IP addresses on the RIPE website as trusted source.
>> 
>> Max
>> 
>> 
>> Maxemilian Hilbrand (Software & Systeme)
>> 
>> CH: +41 71 511 722 0
>> AT (mobile): +43 660 703 92 54
>> maxemilian.hilbrand at isicore.com
>> 
>> isicore AG ? Unterlettenstrasse 14 ? CH-9443 Widnau Gerichtsstandort 
>> CH-9450 Altstätten, UID CHE-110.354.078
>> Verwaltungsratspräsident: Maxemilian Hilbrand
>> 
>> www.isicore.com I  info at isicore.com
>> 
>> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>> Von: members-discuss <members-discuss-bounces at ripe.net> Im Auftrag 
>> von Netmaster
>> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 27. November 2019 14:03
>> An: members-discuss at ripe.net
>> Betreff: Re: [members-discuss] Fwd: Re: RIPE DB T&C violation by 
>> brokers
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> we also received the same mail today.
>> 
>> Regards
>> Stefan
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> Zentrale
>> T +49 731 92013 - 0
>> F +49 731 92013 - 290
>> E info at scanplus.de
>> 
>> scanplus GmbH, sp systemhaus GmbH,
>> Lise-Meitner-Str. 5-7, 89081 Ulm
>> Geschäftsführung: Jürgen Hörmann, Andreas Werther
>> Datenschutzbeauftragter: Thomas Dietrich scanplus GmbH, sp systemhaus 
>> GmbH sind zertifiziert nach DIN EN ISO 9001:2015, ISO/IEC 27001:2013, 
>> Data Center Category TIER 3, scanplus GmbH Amtsgericht Ulm HRB 
>> 3220,www.scanplus.de -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>> Von: members-discuss <members-discuss-bounces at ripe.net> Im Auftrag 
>> von ds at schallert.com
>> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 27. November 2019 12:55
>> An: members-discuss at ripe.net
>> Betreff: [members-discuss] Fwd: Re: RIPE DB T&C violation by brokers
>> 
>> Received this one below today. I'm pretty certain that they're also 
>> pulling contact data from 
>> https://www.ripe.net/membership/indices/data/cc.xxxx.html
>> 
>> Regards
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ### BEGIN ###
>> 
>> -------- Forwarded Message -------
>> From: "Schurr Networks" <contact at jerseypride.org>
>> To: xxxx
>> Date: 27. November 2019 11:13
>> Subject: Acquire IPv4
>> 
>> Greetings,
>> 
>> 
>> Hope this email finds you well.
>> 
>> We will gladly assist if you are interested to Buy / Sell / Lease 
>> IPv4 addresses.
>> 
>> Please feel free to contact me if you have any questions.
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> Kind regards,
>> 
>> Alexandra Schurr
>> 
>> 
>> You received this email because you subscribed at RIPE Database 
>> Webinar
>> 
>> Unsubscribe
>> 
>> 
>> ### END ###
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -------- Weitergeleitete Nachricht -------
>> Von: "Alexander Zubkov" <green at msu.ru>
>> An: "Carlos Friaças" <cfriacas at fccn.pt>, members-discuss at ripe.net
>> CC: exec-board at ripe.net
>> Gesendet: 27. November 2019 00:37
>> Betreff: Re: [members-discuss] RIPE DB T&C violation by brokers 
>> 26.11.2019, 20:16, "Carlos Friaças via members-discuss" <members-discuss at ripe.net>:
>> 
>>> On Tue, 26 Nov 2019, Sander Steffann wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Hi,
>>> The page should reflect this: *these* are the brokers that have 
>>> signed a contract with the NCC, and whoever is not on this page is 
>>> inherently less trustworthy. Or at least, not backed by a NCC contract.
>>>> +1
>>>> 
>>>> Currently the list of brokers is of value to the brokers because it 
>>>> gives them credibility. Let's turn that around and make sure the 
>>>> list is of value to the community instead, with very strict rules 
>>>> and penalties for breaking the rules.
>> There are rules already. See "Recognised IPv4 Transfer Broker Agreement" 
>> link to it is available on the brokers list page:
>> https://www.ripe.net/manage-ips-and-asns/resource-transfers-and-merge
>> rs/brokers 
>> https://www.ripe.net/manage-ips-and-asns/resource-transfers-and-merge
>> rs/brokers/RecognisedIPv4Broker
>> greement.doc
>> But the Supplity is still there, despite:
>> 2. The Broker shall adhere to the relevant RIPE Policies and RIPE NCC 
>> procedural documents ...
>> 4. The Broker does not represent the RIPE NCC and shall not imply or 
>> create the impression to third parties that they represent the RIPE NCC.
>> 6. This agreement shall be terminated:
>> * By the RIPE NCC with immediate effect if the Broker violates any of 
>> their obligations as outlined in this agreement ...
>> 
>> And it is known for sure, that Supplity impersonates RIPE NCC on its 
>> Facebook page (still), they were lying in their spam about getting 
>> e-mail on RIPE NCC's training courses. They are obviously using RIPE 
>> DB to collect e-mails to send their spam messages.
>> 
>> PS. I reported their page to Facebook several days ago, but looks 
>> like they are not going to do anything with it or may be waiting for 
>> zillions of reports. So who can - please make more reports about 
>> their page: (...) -> Find Support or Report Page -> Scams and Fake 
>> Pages -> Pretending to be Another Business (or another report reason 
>> you find suitable). May be it will help.
>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> Are there any strict rules *today*?
>>> 
>>> Are there any penalties for breaking the rules (if there are any) *today*?
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> Carlos
>>> 
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Sander
>>> _______________________________________________
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