[members-discuss] LIR’s billing issues with RIPE NCC, need support

The 24-month rule may prevent "fast" money, but the payment requirement for all LIRs before transfer makes a dent in the "slow" money. 

-- 
Regards,
   Terrence Koeman, PhD/MTh/BPsy
      Darkness Reigns (Holding) B.V.

Please quote relevant replies.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: members-discuss <members-discuss-bounces at ripe.net> On Behalf Of ripe-
> member-discuss+lr at c2play.de
> Sent: Tuesday, December 4, 2018 11:25 AM
> To: members-discuss at ripe.net
> Subject: Re: [members-discuss] LIR’s billing issues with RIPE NCC, need
> support
> 
> > Sebastian Wiesinger sebastian.wiesinger at noris.net  [Tue Dec 4 08:53:56
> CET 2018]
> > The RIPE NCC fees are anually. As a convenience *to you* you can also
> > pay them quarterly (we don't). This has been discussed multiple times.
> 
> 
> > Regards
> 
> 
> > Sebastian
> 
> 
> That is, in the light of the matter of this discussion, not quite correct.
> Yes, the fees are annual - but they are charged on a pro rata basis, so for
> example, LIRs don't pay a full annual fee of €1,400 when they become LIR in
> the last quarter of 2018. They only pay for the last quarter of 2018.
> 
> 
> What the starter of the discussion criticizes is that LIRs not only have to
> pay member fees retroactively, they also have to pay it when those LIRs are
> not involved in the transfer at all.
> 
> 
> To be honest, I think that RIPE NCC is a very fair RIR, if not the fairest.
> But I also admit that this rule is quite confusing: To prevent impatient
> people from creating a LIR in the last quarter of a year, then transfering
> the resource(s) and closing the LIR to make fast money, we already have a
> rule which states that scarce resources cannot be transfered within the first
> 24 months after the resource was allocated.
> 
> 
> There may be also other reasons for companies to create multiple LIRs than
> making fast money. Many people do legitime business. Also in the earlier days
> of RIPE NCC some companies had multiple LIRs.
> 
> 
> With that said, I don't think the way how fees are charged for such transfers
> is consistent, it is quite confusing. On the other hand RIPE NCC has a
> legitime interest to prevent people from making fast money; but here we
> already have an effective rule: The 24 months restriction.
> 
> 
> So the question is: What is the reason for this rule if you think we need it
> to be kept?
> 
> 
> ________________________________
> 
> From: Dave Benwell <dave at it-communicationsltd.co.uk>
> Sent: Tuesday, 4. Dec 2018 – 10:39 CET +0100
> To: Sebastian Wiesinger <sebastian.wiesinger at noris.net>
> members-discuss at ripe.net
> 
> Subject: Re: [members-discuss] LIR’s billing issues with RIPE NCC, need
> support
> 
> 
> Additional accounts are normally setup to get more IP Space
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: members-discuss [mailto:members-discuss-bounces at ripe.net] On Behalf Of
> Sebastian Wiesinger
> Sent: 04 December 2018 07:54
> To: members-discuss at ripe.net
> Subject: Re: [members-discuss] LIR’s billing issues with RIPE NCC, need
> support
> 
> * Juri <hostmaster at ntx.ru> [2018-12-04 08:09]:
> > I suggest RIPE NCC do correct accounting for each LIR for the time
> > this LIR instance exists. If LIR has annual billing - then RIPE NCC
> > should use it. If LIR selected quarterly billing - RIPE NCC show use.
> > But RIPE NCC should not overcharge LIRs for the time they didn't give
> > any services for LIR instance.
> 
> The RIPE NCC fees are anually. As a convenience *to you* you can also pay
> them quarterly (we don't). This has been discussed multiple times.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Sebastian
> 
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