[members-discuss] [Ticket#2012072401002498] Probably Free /8 networks in RIPE region
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William Weber
ripe-members-discussion at edisglobal.com
Fri Jul 27 12:16:03 CEST 2012
Yea.... we all know you are *THE* expert about hijacked space ;-) -- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh william at edisglobal.com | william at edis.at | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Graz, Austria Am 27.07.2012 um 12:14 schrieb Sven Olaf Kamphuis: > how about the entire class-e space (244/8 and up) > > milnet (21,22,26) > > etc > > all of which not-announced at all. > > but better you just switch to v6 :P > > as for the e-class space, nobody seems to 'claim' it so just use it lol > > > On Fri, 27 Jul 2012, Paolo Di Francesco wrote: > >> Hi William >> >> >>> WIND uses by far *more* than 5mil IPs - They are the second largest >>> access provider in Italy, in fact they are so short already that they >>> run NAT now... >> >> I guess it's not the only net allocated to wind, but just to make things >> clear regarding the IPv4-IPv6 situation in Italy: >> >> 1) at the current date each provider MUST allocate one public IPv4 for >> each contract (not customer, contract, which means if you have one >> company with 50 employees at minimum one public IPv4 must be allocated) >> 2) NAT (=multiple customers beyond one public IP) with some form of >> "connection tracking" has been proposed, but yet not accepted by the >> Italian government >> 3) the big telco told us that dual stack cannot be done and they will >> never implement it so far because: >> 3.a) there is no mobile device well supporting IPv6 >> 3.b) IPv6 traffic is insignificant, the traffic is only IPv4 (well if >> they do not provider IPv6 to customers I see some barriers to have IPv6 >> traffic...) >> 3.c) IPv6 WILL NOT HAPPEN for a looooong time, and they will NOT provide >> dual stack >> 3.d) xDSL modems do not support IPv6 (maybe they should change modem >> brand, I don't know) >> 3.e) operating systems are not supporting IPv6 >> >> We asked them to give dual stack, but the message that I have heard is: >> no only IPv4 and NAT is the solution for the future, then maybe in some >> years (5? 10? 20??) we will reconsider IPv6 >> >> Therefore I see small and medium ISP running dual stack to be "future >> ready" while large operators in Italy will run IPv4 and NAT for a long, >> long time. >> >> Now if RIPE will consider a dual fee for IPv4 and IPv6 I guess that it >> will not help small LIRs to implement IPv6 and that will be a huge >> damage for the whole community. >> >> It will be funny that small ISP are implementing IPv6 and maybe paying >> more than big telcos. >> >> Regarding the IPv4-IPv6 policy, my personal opinion is that it's a >> commercial war: the longer IPv6 dual stack or transition will take, the >> better will be to keep the market closed and the current positions >> untouched. >> >> Should we consider an extra fee if you do NOT use IPv6 for customers???? >> >> But as I said, we should split the two discussions: one regarding IPv4 >> and IPv6 allocation (and mistakes of the past, when nobody knew what the >> hell was an IP) and another one regarding RIPE fees. Not saying those >> two things are not related just saying that IPv4 re-allocation policy >> for huge systems should be taken into serious consideration >> >> As a last note: if Wind and other operators are using NAT and they are >> happy with that (instead of implementing dual stack and migration >> mechanisms) then they DO NOT NEED IPv4, and then then can give it back >> to RIPE. If with one IPv4 you can put 1,000-10,000 customers, hey we are >> 60 millions in Italy we need few public IPv4 for big LIRS, right? >> >> Best regards >> >> >> -- >> >> >> Ing. Paolo Di Francesco >> >> Level7 s.r.l. unipersonale >> >> Sede operativa: Largo Montalto, 5 - 90144 Palermo >> >> C.F. e P.IVA 05940050825 >> Fax : +39-091-8772072 >> assistenza: (+39) 091-8776432 >> web: http://www.level7.it >> >> >> >> >> ---- >> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss >> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: >> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view >> >> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses. >> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <https://lists.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/members-discuss/attachments/20120727/aef5b415/attachment.html>
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