[lir-wg] ripe allocation 82.0.0.0/8 and arin allocation 69.0.0.0/8

Hi,

On Thu, Jan 02, 2003 at 07:18:28AM -0500, Joe Baptista wrote:
> On Thu, 2 Jan 2003, leo vegoda wrote:
> 
> > The RIPE NCC can not guarantee whether any particular route will
> > be accepted by any network operator.
> 
> Thats a problem.  Question - if one of your customers discovers that an
> allocation does not route can they have it replaced with one that does.

Not speaking for the RIPE NCC, of course, but knowing the procedures
fairly well.  The answer is "no", of course.

There was a trial phase when blocks from 62.0.0.0/8 was initially handed 
out (because it wasn't understood what bad effects using a "former A"
might have), but that does not apply to any other /8.

It is *not* RIPE's responsibility to guarantee routeability of anything.

If people mess up their filters, *they* have to fix it.  Talk to them,
talk to their upstreams, distribute clue.

[..]
> I understand you don't guarantee any particular allocation will route.
> And in the old days when the charges were minimal for IP allocation - well
> one could reluctantly accept that.  However - under the new policies you
> boys are charging these people hefty bucks and that means liability and I
> don't think it prudent to hide behind the routing claim.  I have
> documented over 15 cases in which the 69.0.0.0/8 fiasco has cost these
> people clients and business that went elsewhere.

I have no idea what you are talking about.  RIPE does NOT charge 
per-allocation.  If you have a problem with ARIN, go and complain to them.

[..]
> So if you do get complaints regarding 82.0.0.0/8 - do you intend to make
> sure your customers get network that work - or will RIPE be following the
> ARIN lead and just let these people hang.

It's RIPE's job to manage the number space, and the number space is 
limited (!).  Before long, *there is no other space* than "former A"
to allocate from - and if that space is filtered at some point in the
network, it's the responsibility of the person filtering, not the 
people trying to manage a limited resource in the best possible way.

(Not that I am always in 100% agreement with what the RIPE or ARIN people
do, but *this* is not something they have influence upon).

Gert Doering
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