[anti-abuse-wg] Fwd: Re: botnet controllers

If I'm listing /24s, instead of addresses, and I clearly state, "within this /24 the following IP addresses have been reported as abusers" and probably other information such as "they do not resolve the abuse cases/they are responding efficiently, etc.", I don't think there is anything wrong.

The evil can be in the details, I fully agree, and is difficult to judge if not having "all" the complete set of data.

If they are doing "bad things" on purpose or by negligence, even if they aren't disclosing the real identities, the courts, will take care of it in most of the jurisdictions. It will take more time, but this is normal with anything related to law ... unfortunately.

By the way, I'm not defending them. I don't know them. Don't know who they are, but I could understand why they don't want to hide.

I could tell several personal histories when I brought to Data Protection Agencies/courts several massive spam/abuse cases, and they really tried to do really bad things to me personally. You will be scared.

There are real *criminal* organizations behind many "so-called" email marketing companies, spams, hijacks, etc. We all know. They happily will not care to kill anyone if you threaten them.

Regards,
Jordi
@jordipalet
 
 

El 8/7/20 17:49, "anti-abuse-wg-bounces at ripe.net en nombre de info at fos-vpn.org" <anti-abuse-wg-bounces at ripe.net en nombre de info at fos-vpn.org> escribió:

    @Jordi Palet Martinez: If Spamhaus would just list IP addresses we 
    wouldn't mind that. The reality is different though.
    We brought a /24 prefix to a certain hosting provider which I don't want 
    to name here and a few weeks after that Spamhaus listed the other clean 
    prefixes of that company (which have no direct connection to our IPs) on 
    SBL.
    The result was that all other customers were unable to sent any emails. 
    The company had to refund them, resulting in a financial damage of more 
    than 7000 Euros.
    There is no way to prevent this, because right after legal actions were 
    taken in the United Kingdom by one of our upstream partners they moved 
    their companys' headquarters to Andorra, which is outside the EU.
    Spamhaus is no legal entity, but they behave like one. They can do that 
    because during recent years they gained an enormous power: Most email 
    providers take their lists without any question, so if they want they 
    can destroy an entire hosting provider, and if you want to take legal 
    actions against them you need to find a law firm which is active in 
    Andorra.
    Why don't they reveal their identities like BitNinja does in its 
    imprint?
    Then all parties could present their evidence in court.





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