[anti-abuse-wg] Astroturfing?

Hi,


On Wed, 3 Apr 2019, Sascha Luck [ml] wrote:

> Please provide evidence for your insinuation that anyone here
> discriminates against Portuguese (or any other nationality for
> that matter.) I can't but regard such an insinuation as a cheap
> rhetorical trick.

Too easy (you might have missed this one...):
========
Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2019 22:00:32
From: Sergey Myasoedov via anti-abuse-wg <anti-abuse-wg at ripe.net>
Reply-To: Sergey Myasoedov <sergey at devnull.ru>
To: anti-abuse-wg at ripe.net
Subject: Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Proposal 2019-03 BGP Hijacking

Dear group members from Portugal stated your support for 2019-03,
Can you please provide some more arguments than your humble "+1" 
statement? This is a working group, not a voting.

Please.
========

The message was directed to a "group members from Portugal".
Members from IE, IL, US, CZ and so on that made brief statements of 
support were left out of this request.
I can't understand why.



(...)
> I've long argued that all policy should only be discussed in
> ap-wg as I don't think this limited an audience should make
> policy with far-reaching consequences. Alas, everyone wants to
> rule in Hell rather than serve in Heaven.

What you argue is _not_ "current rules" or the PDP.

Anyone who wants to participate in discussing 2019-03 only has to 
subscribe to this mailing list.



>> If someone has any doubt about if newcomers are real persons, then please 
>> Google away. :-)
>
> Well, that gives me:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sockpuppet_(Internet)#Meatpuppet
>
> So the term "Astroturfing" is technically incorrect as that
> implies fictitious entities with some commercial interest behind
> it.

So you're now going further than attacking one nationality, aiming at all 
those who expressed support for 2019-03? (i.e. disagreeing with your 
view).

I'm not going reply with a different Wikipedia URL, but i suspect you know 
which one i'm thinking about :-))

(Alireza, Brian, Tobias, please feel free to comment on the above URL)



> Nobody has said that and new participants are always welcome, the
> more know about this the better.

It's not only about "knowing" it's also being able to support or oppose 
any proposal (present or future). For me the keyword is "participation".



> However: If someone shows up here only to add a "+1" to a
> proposal and is then never heard from again, I don't think their
> support should carry much weight. I trust the chairs to consider
> this, of course.

You might be rushing to judgements.
You might draw that conclusion if there is more to discuss on the table 6 
months or 1 year from now, and people stay silent or if they left the 
mailing list -- which is something noone can evaluate on such a short 
notice.



Regards,
Carlos



> rgds,
> SL
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Wed, 3 Apr 2019, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote:
>> 
>>> All
>>> 
>>> Is someone encouraging astroturfing?
>>> 
>>> The number of either new or inactive members of this list who have posted 
>>> one line messages in support of the recent policy discussion has reached 
>>> insane levels
>>> 
>>> Regards
>>> 
>>> Michele???
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Mr Michele Neylon
>>> Blacknight Solutions
>>> Hosting, Colocation & Domains
>>> https://www.blacknight.com/
>>> https://blacknight.blog/
>>> Intl. +353 (0) 59  9183072
>>> Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090
>>> Personal blog: https://michele.blog/
>>> Some thoughts: https://ceo.hosting/
>>> -------------------------------
>>> Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business 
>>> Park,Sleaty
>>> Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,R93 X265,Ireland  Company No.: 370845
>>> 
>>> 
>