[anti-abuse-wg] GDPR - positive effects on email abuse

There is a balanced discussion to be had here but unfortunately it too quickly dissolves into acrimonious “shouting”. Volker's email expressing one side in a somewhat antagonistic fashion being a good example of the “shouting".

As things stand at the moment, the interpretations of GDPR and subsequent actions of some large organisations make it likely that fraud and other types of malpractice, largely aimed at individual users, will increase.

The stated position "that tool was illegal to begin with as it violated the rights to privacy of millions of domain owners” is, at best, misleading. Assuming the “tool” being referred to is WHIOS, registrants of domains needed to provide information as part of their contract with the registrar. A contractual requirement. Perfectly OK pre GDPR, perfectly OK post GDPR.

Publishing that data was perfectly legal pre-GDPR. It _may_ be legal post GDPR. Until this is tested in court, definitives are just so much posturing. And the argument is likely to be more nuanced anyway. If I want to register a domain and am told up front, in clear unambiguous language that the details I provide will appear in a publicly queryable database as part of the contract, job done. I may not like it. I may decide that I don’t want to enter into the contract. And that’s rather the point. Informed consent.

Law enforcement doesn't provide anti-virus tools. Law enforcement doesn't offer secure transport services for cash and gold. Law enforcement doesn’t provide locks for front doors. Private companies provide those services. Your fancifully termed ""Private researchers" and other vigilantes or rent-a-cops” work to provide tools and services to enable people to protect themselves from bad actors online, not law enforcement. It is folly to remove tools used by these private companies to protect billions without at least some form of balanced debate.

At ICANN, Puerto Rico, one member of a public interest board put it quite well when he stated that when it comes to protecting the interests of a few million (domain owners) versus protecting the interests of a few billion (internet users), he’d always come done on the side of the billions. I agree with the sentiment.

Simon


> On 29 May 2018, at 12:36, Volker Greimann <vgreimann at key-systems.net> wrote:
> 
> Wow, the level of narrowmindedness and fearmongering is high with this one.
> 
> Crime online will likely not increase due to GDPR. It may be more difficult to detect and take action against due to the loss of one tool amongst many, but ultimately that tool was illegal to begin with as it violated the rights to privacy of millions of domain owners.
> 
> "Private researchers" and other vigilantes or rent-a-cops will indeed have a more difficult time to obtain such data as they will finally have to do so by legal means, but then they are in an untenable position anyway, taking upon themselves functions that should be fulfilled by actual law enforcement.
> 
> Ultimately, private data if internet users no longer being public will lead to better registration data for those with a right to access it. Those with no such rights will have to figure out alternate routes to do their jobs that does not violate the rights of millions.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Volker
> 
> 
> 
> Am 28.05.2018 um 21:13 schrieb Ronald F. Guilmette:
>> ox <andre at ox.co.za> wrote:
>> 
>>> Firstly I would like to comment that the multinationals and their funded trade
>>> groups (and their lobby orgs) shouted from the rooftops that if the GDPR came
>>> into effect, Internet in the EU would collapse and there would be digital doom
>>> and gloom.
>> I am not a multinational.  I am an individual volunteer anti-abuse researcher.
>> And yet even -I- have told everyone I know that the disappearance of public
>> WHOIS is and will be an epic catastrophy.  If there was cybercrime on the
>> Internet before, it will be increased, going forward, by tenfold.
>> 
>>> How wrong they were (hindsight is perfect - as we can all clearly see)
>> Be patient.  The change has only just occurred.
>> 
>>> The EU has truly become a world and global leader in the reclamation of
>>> individual rights and the free Internet.
>> Here on this side of the pond, one usually has to turn on Fox News in order
>> to be treated to this level of rubbish.
>> 
>> The only thing that has happened is that private researchers the world
>> over have been effectively blinded due to the supreme arogance and idiocy
>> of europeans... europeans who, in their religious fervor, have come to view
>> it as their holy obligation to foist their demented notions onto the rest
>> of the world, whether any of the rest of us like it or not.
>> 
>> Meanwhile the malevolent forces of state-sponsored intrigue and violation
>> of human rights are and shall remain totally unfettered and unaffected by
>> GDPR, as they will be the first ones to obtain special exemptions allowing
>> them to continue to see WHOIS data.  The CIA, NSA, BDN, and FSB are
>> undoubtedly celebrating the arrival of GDPR, as it further entrenches
>> their special status at the expense of the great unwashes masses.
>> 
>> Friday was a sad day for both transparency and democracy, but all across
>> the globe both criminals and statists undoubtedly celebrated it with
>> toasts of champaign.
>> 
>> 
>> Regards,
>> rfg
>> 
> 
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