[anti-abuse-wg] Re: Use of RIPE region space by out-of-region users, was RIPE policy

Ronald,

On Wed, 2011-03-09 at 05:51 -0800, Ronald F. Guilmette wrote:
> >So, my guess would be that the Ukrainian holder of this PI block decided
> >to have it hosted by an American company.
> 
> I wish there were an emoticon for a double-take.
> 
> As there isn't, I'll just say "Eh?? Come again??"
> 
> So let me see if I get this.  A ``provider'' in the RIPE region can go
> to RIPE and ask for a hunk of IP space.  When RIPE gives the organization
> in question the space, then that organization can just turn around and give
> it to anybody else they damn well please.  They don't have to provide any
> connectivity.  They can just take the block and have it ``hosted'' (your
> word, not mine) with some totally different ACTUAL connectivity provider
> elsewhere?  Is that what you are saying?

Yes, that's right.

> Does the organization that first obtained the space from RIPE even have
> to be the one announcing routes to the space?

No, of course not. This is PI space - provider independent. There are
several different models for use of this space. One model is for the
organization to buy its own routers and act as network operators for the
space. Another model is to have someone else manage the space for you.
The important thing for the organization that receives the space is that
if they are unhappy with the service provided, that they can move to
another provider and not have to renumber.

> >> Someone suggested that there already exists a policy to the effect that
> >> providing IP block without also providing connectivity is a no-no.
> >> 
> >> Or did I misunderstand that?
> >
> >You did misunderstand that.
> >
> >As I understand it, you can request IP space if you either are an LIR or
> >can find an LIR to request a PI block for you, and you have a need for
> >it. This need might be providing connectivity, but it could also be web
> >hosting, or video delivery, or download farms, or research networks, or
> >a million other purposes that may or may not have been invented yet.
> 
> Jesus!  Really?
> 
> *I* have a real, legitimate, and serious need for... umm... a /14 right now,
> because you know, what with the economic crisis of the past couple of years
> my retirement account has been seriously diminished, and I need to restore
> it to its former glory if I am to have any hope of retiring this century.
> So I "need" a /14 from RIPE.   I need it because there are a whole lot of
> spammers on this side of the pond who will pay me Big Bucks for even just
> a /21, and I can break up the /14 and resell it as a whole lot of of smaller
> blocks (to the spammers).

I believe you can only get space you are going to use in the next 3
months now, although that may be even smaller. I don't know the exact
criteria, but it generally involves business plans and numbering and
suchlike. You may need to provide a list of your customers - again I
don't really know. In principle I believe that mass mailing meets the
requirements, but you'd probably need to get small blocks and then go
back to the RIPE NCC after you can demonstrate that each one has become
poisoned (probably pointing out the blackhole lists that you're on
should be enough).

> So, um, where exactly does one apply for a RIPE IPv4 allocation?

Either become an LIR:

https://www.ripe.net/lir-services/member-support/become-a-member

Or if you only need PI space, then contact an LIR in your area and ask
it to help you with your PI request:

https://www.ripe.net/membership/indices/

> I'll move to France if I have to.  It will be worth it.

Bon courage, mon ami!

--
Shane