[ripe-list] LIR and Member Agreements

Dear colleagues,

Earlier this year, Denis Walker (RIPE Database Working Group co-Chair) 
emailed with a list of comments and suggestions to improve our legal 
framework and documentation, and specifically the SSA and LIR Account 
Agreement. First off, we would like to thank Denis for taking the time 
and effort to review all of this and for sending his suggestions for 
improvement and clarity. The Legal Department at the RIPE NCC has 
devoted quite some time to looking at all the comments and checking 
whether we need to make changes based on them.

Some of the comments they found should not lead to changes in the text 
as there are valid legal reasons to keep it as is or there are no legal 
reasons to amend the text. The areas where we agree we need to make 
changes are listed below:

- Correct a number of typos as suggested
- Clarify the applicability of the arbitration procedure in conflicts 
arising from the LIR Account Agreement
- Review the needs-based criterion mentioned in the procedural document 
about Closure of Members and Deregistration of Resources
- Align the wording on our webpages regarding the term “service fee- 
annual contribution”

The RIPE NCC can start to implement some of these changes quite soon. 
For amendments concerning the SSA, they will need to make changes that 
require the approval of the RIPE NCC General Meeting. They plan to make 
the proposed amendments ahead of the GM in May 2023 and request that the 
members approve the changes to the relevant documents there.

It is also clear that the distinction between LIRs and RIPE NCC members 
is one that causes confusion, and we believe this is an area where both 
the membership and community should discuss how best to ensure there is 
clarity in this area. In the legal documentation, it refers to RIPE NCC 
members that may have one or more LIR accounts. The RIPE NCC will 
continue to make improvements based on both the legal and policy 
requirements that we work under.

Again, we very much appreciate this input and think it will lead to 
greater clarity for everyone.

Best regards,

Ondřej Filip
RIPE NCC Executive Board Chair

[1] 
https://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ripe-list/2022-January/002418.html


On 01/02/2022 15:20, Christian Kaufmann wrote:
> Dear Denis,
> Dear Fellow Members,
> Dear all,
> 
> First of all thanks a lot to Denis for all his work, I imagine it must 
> have taken hours.
> We, the board and the NCC will follow up on it and will not just have a 
> look at the content itself but also look into how did we end up in this 
> situation in the first place.
> We will come back to the mailing list after the legal evaluation is 
> conducted and also report on this at the next RIPE Meeting.
> 
> Regarding the CoC aspect of this emails, we the board did not read Hans 
> Petters comments as shutting down the conversation or policing anyone 
> and we would not have allowed that.
> 
> Best regards and please keep a respectful discussion in this challenging 
> times.
> 
> Christian Kaufmann
> Chairman of the NCC Executive Board
> 
> 
> 
>> On 31. Jan 2022, at 20:58, Hans Petter Holen <hph at ripe.net 
>> <mailto:hph at ripe.net>> wrote:
>>
>> Dennis,
>> Since you are a working group chair I am making this response in public.
>>
>> Thank you very much for your feedback on the LIR and Member Agreements.
>>
>> I do welcome constructive feedback and suggestions for improvements.
>>
>> I will not comment on your email right now, now but I will, however, 
>> point you to the RIPE Code of Conduct.
>>
>> https://www.ripe.net/publications/docs/ripe-766 
>> <https://www.ripe.net/publications/docs/ripe-766>
>>
>> I read your characterisations of the document, as
>> "This is probably one of the worst»
>>
>> as well as numerous others characterisations I will refrain from 
>> quoting,  though out the document as completely unnecessary.
>>
>> They are not helping everyone to feel safe and included.
>>
>> Your choice of language does in my opinion, not adhere to the 
>> following principles from the Code of Conduct:
>>
>> • Being considerate and showing empathy towards others, especially 
>> when disagreeing or raising issues
>> • Giving/receiving feedback or suggestions in a positive way.
>> • Using welcoming and inclusive language
>>
>> I would like to encourage a healthy discussion for improving the 
>> document, but you make it very difficult for me to do so, and I 
>> sincerely hope the tone of the discussion can be constructive.
>>
>> Sincerely,
>>
>> Hans Petter Holen
>> Managing Director
>> RIPE NCC
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> <signature.asc>
> 
>