<html><head> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8"/> </head> <body> <p>Perhaps we should also consider that if someone is capable of reverse engineering and hacking an exam app to cheat the system, perhaps their skill set is beyond what RIPE are teaching anyway.</p> <p>If someone wanted to flat out cheat by having someone do the work for them, what stops them having a second screen in front of them and a cheap screen capture device. Completely undetectable - it would just look like you're looking at your keyboard.</p> <p>There becomes a point where the right to privacy outweighs the need for security. This attempt at security, if it can even be called that - is laughable.</p> <p>Regards,<br/> Josh Jameson<br/> </p> <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 5/25/23 15:45, Andreas Grabmüller | QuarIT GmbH wrote:<br/> </div> <blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:022301d98f17$9260d6a0$b72283e0$@quarit.de"> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8"/> <meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)"/>  <style>@font-face {font-family:"Cambria Math"; panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}@font-face {font-family:Calibri; panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {margin:0cm; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}a:link, span.MsoHyperlink {mso-style-priority:99; color:blue; text-decoration:underline;}span.E-MailFormatvorlage21 {mso-style-type:personal-compose; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:windowtext;}.MsoChpDefault {mso-style-type:export-only; font-size:10.0pt; mso-ligatures:none;}div.WordSection1 {page:WordSection1;}</style> <div class="WordSection1"> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Hi Alvaro,<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-US">I’ve got a question about this (as I honestly don’t know). Do people care about “secure”? I agree that it’s important to offer learning opportunities because it helps us all, but is RIPE a school that offers some state approved certificates or something? If not, why do we need tests at all and especially some testing methology that can be so privacy invasive?<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-US">I think it benefits us all to offer learning opportunities to everyone (not just members) because mistakes others make create work for us. But I’m not sure what the benefit of competing with commercial training vendors (who make their money by providing certificates) is to us.<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US" lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Mit freundlichen Grüßen<br/> <br/> Andreas Grabmüller<o:p></o:p></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><img style="width:2.0833in;height:.7395in" id="Grafik_x0020_2" src="cid:part1.c6wBLzR0.cSqzrv70@servebyte.com" class="" width="200" height="71"/><o:p></o:p></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#686D70"><br/> QuarIT GmbH \</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">\</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#686D70"> Jägerstraße 19 \</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">\</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#686D70"> 83308 Trostberg \</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">\</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#686D70"> Deutschland<br/> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:a.grabmueller@quarit.de">a.grabmueller@quarit.de</a> \</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">\</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#686D70"> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.quaritec.de">www.quaritec.de</a> \</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">\</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#686D70"> Telefon: +49 8621 994900-0 \</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">\</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#686D70"> Telefax: +49 8621 994900-9<br/> Amtsgericht Traunstein: HRB 23872 \</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">\</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#686D70"> Sitz: Trostberg \</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">\</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#686D70"> Geschäftsführer: Andreas Grabmüller \</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">\</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#686D70"> Ust.-ID: DE297594275<br/> Allgemeine Geschäftsbedingungen: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.quaritec.de/agb">http://www.quaritec.de/agb</a> \</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:black">\</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#686D70"> Aktuelle Preisliste: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.quaritec.de/preise">http://www.quaritec.de/preise</a> </span><o:p></o:p></p> </div> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <div> <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm"> <p class="MsoNormal"><b>Von:</b> members-discuss <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net"><members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net></a> <b>Im Auftrag von </b>Alvaro Vives<br/> <b>Gesendet:</b> Donnerstag, 25. Mai 2023 10:44<br/> <b>An:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:members-discuss@ripe.net">members-discuss@ripe.net</a><br/> <b>Betreff:</b> Re: [members-discuss] [news] RIPE NCC Certified Professionals is Back Online<o:p></o:p></p> </div> </div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Dear Thomas, <o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">There are a few dozen remote exam providers, who in turn rely on a much smaller number of proctoring companies like Proctorio. So there are alternatives, but the list quickly shrinks once you apply the kinds of requirements we have, and once we review the various legal (GDPR) and security aspects. We chose the service that provided the best experience, that was in line with our internal procedures, and which allowed us to avoid overly intrusive or absurd requirements. For Certified Professionals, we’re only using one of Proctorio’s services, the ‘record and review’ service. Further, only select RIPE NCC staff can access recordings, for a limited duration, and under specific circumstances.<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">You are asking if Proctorio is the kind of company that the RIPE NCC should engage with. We agree that the behaviour described in the articles you’ve shared is distasteful, but we also need to be realistic about our situation: we want to offer a quality exam experience that is secure, legally compliant, and meets the needs of our members. Ultimately, we want candidate’s experience of the new system to guide our decisions. However, we will continue to monitor developments concerning Proctorio, as well as feedback on the service that we are using. <o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Kind regards,<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Alvaro Vives<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Team Manager<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Learning and Development<o:p></o:p></p> </div> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><br/> <br/> <o:p></o:p></p> <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">On 19 May 2023, at 17:15, Thomas Schweizer-Bolzonello via members-discuss <<a href="mailto:members-discuss@ripe.net" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">members-discuss@ripe.net</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> <div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Hello,<o:p></o:p></p> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">I am reacting to the recent news email about RIPE NCC training/certifications.<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">I wish to know who at RIPE thought it was the best choice to select such a company engaged in multiple lawsuits to proctor the RIPE exams? Am I the only one concerned about this, weren't there other more appropriate solutions to keep the RIPE certification exams appropriately monitored for fair play and fair examinations?<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">[1] <a href="https://news.slashdot.org/story/20/11/06/0011221/proctoring-software-company-used-dmca-to-take-down-a-students-critical-tweets" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://news.slashdot.org/story/20/11/06/0011221/proctoring-software-company-used-dmca-to-take-down-a-students-critical-tweets</a><o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">[2] <a href="https://twitter.com/ejohnson99/status/1303121786637373443" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://twitter.com/ejohnson99/status/1303121786637373443</a><o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Best regards,<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Thomas<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> <div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">---------- Forwarded message ---------<br/> From: <strong><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Alvaro Vives</span></strong> <<a href="mailto:avives@ripe.net" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">avives@ripe.net</a>><br/> Date: Fri, 19 May 2023 at 17:35<br/> Subject: [ncc-announce] [news] RIPE NCC Certified Professionals is Back Online<br/> To: <<a href="mailto:ncc-announce@ripe.net" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">ncc-announce@ripe.net</a>><o:p></o:p></p> </div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br/> <br/> Dear colleagues,<br/> <br/> I’m very pleased to report that RIPE NCC Certified Professionals is back online! We took a hiatus for a few weeks to transition to a new exam platform. I would also like to thank all the RIPE community members who helped us test this new system, for not only taking the exam but also for sharing your feedback with us.<br/> <br/> Here are some of the biggest changes that we’ve made:<br/> - You no longer need to schedule exams in advance - you can take an exam on demand.<br/> - We now use the services of Better Examinations, a Europe-based exam provider.<br/> - Exams are no longer “live proctored” but use a record and review system instead. This system uses Proctorio, and it’s important to note that the exam recordings are accessible only to select RIPE NCC staff, and for a limited duration. Test takers are also no longer obliged to scan the room before taking exams.<br/> - You are no longer obliged to use government-issued identification cards to register for the exam - any photo ID will do. We look for a match between the name and photo on the ID document with the test taker.<br/> - We can introduce more interactive questions in the exams, as the new platform offers greater flexibility.<br/> - There are no longer any geographic restrictions on accessing the exam platform.<br/> <br/> We’ve published a more detailed article on RIPE Labs on what these changes involve:<br/> <a href="https://labs.ripe.net/author/william-johnson/get-certified-20-introducing-the-new-ripe-ncc-certified-professionals-exam-platform/" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://labs.ripe.net/author/william-johnson/get-certified-20-introducing-the-new-ripe-ncc-certified-professionals-exam-platform/</a><br/> <br/> For those of you who have been waiting to get certified, I invite you to claim your vouchers and try out our new exam system. Your new vouchers for 2023 are now available and valid until the end of this year!<br/> <a href="https://getcertified.ripe.net/" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://getcertified.ripe.net/</a><br/> <br/> Best of luck to those of you who have scheduled exams at RIPE 86, or who plan to take exams soon (and yes we have t-shirts if you get certified). <br/> <br/> Kind regards,<br/> <br/> Alvaro Vives<br/> Team Manager<br/> Learning and Development<o:p></o:p></p> </div> </div> </div> </div> <p class="MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br/> members-discuss mailing list<br/> <a href="mailto:members-discuss@ripe.net" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">members-discuss@ripe.net</a><br/> <a href="https://mailman.ripe.net/" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://mailman.ripe.net/</a><br/> Unsubscribe: <a href="https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/options/members-discuss/avives%40ripe.net" moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/options/members-discuss/avives%40ripe.net</a><o:p></o:p></p> </div> </blockquote> </div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> </blockquote> </body></html>