<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><span id="docs-internal-guid-13bcaa4e-7fff-a4d3-7d33-0350c187f7d8" class=""><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span id="docs-internal-guid-31deb1db-7fff-acef-f4f4-3fb674920543" class=""><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class="">Dear Lu,</span></div><br class=""><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class="">I am more than willing to give my thoughts on some aspects of this. However, there is little value to be had in repeatedly stating the RIPE NCC position or in debating the finer points of Mauritian law.</span></div><br class=""><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class="">Instead, I will simply say that I agree with the text in your emails that advocates for community-driven, bottom-up principles, and that a properly functioning Internet Number Registry System benefits our members and those of the other RIRs. These are areas where there seems to be common ground between us, and I hope they will guide your actions as you pursue your agenda.</span></div><br class=""><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class="">One famous mantra in our community is to "keep it simple". In a community of such diverse backgrounds and competing interests, keeping it simple is not just an abstract value but a practical means of allowing people to see the best outcomes and to make valuable contributions effectively.</span></div><br class=""><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class="">The situation around AFRINIC has become anything but simple. There are numerous court cases brought by several parties. New organisations have sprung up to push the agendas of different individuals and groups through a wide range of media. There are governance issues to be resolved at AFRINIC. </span></div><br class=""><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class="">In such an environment, missteps are likely to happen on all sides, leading to further noise. It is clear to me that the complexity itself is getting in the way of resolving matters to everyone's satisfaction.</span></div><br class=""><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class="">So I will not presume to advise you on how to conduct your affairs in a different RIR region. However, I will ask you to keep in mind this mantra as you pursue your interests. Keep it simple. Leave room for people to focus on resolving the issues at hand.</span></div><br class=""><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class="">Where I can be of assistance is in talking to AFRINIC and the other RIRs at the global level and making sure they are aware of the issues that you and others have raised here regarding the health of the Internet Number Registry System. This is obviously something that is important for us all.</span></div><br class=""><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class="">Regards,</span></div><br class=""><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class="">Hans Petter Holen</span></div><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class="">Managing Director</span></div><div style="line-height: 1.38; margin-top: 0pt; margin-bottom: 0pt;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class="">RIPE NCC</span></div><div class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class=""><br class=""></span></div></span></div><div class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-east-asian: normal; font-variant-position: normal; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap;" class=""><br class=""></span></div></span>
<div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On 22 Jul 2022, at 17:12, Heng Lu <<a href="mailto:h.lu@outsideheaven.com" class="">h.lu@outsideheaven.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div style="margin: 0px 0px 0pt; line-height: 1.2;" class=""><span style="font-family: Roboto; font-size: 12pt;" class="">Dear Hans:</span></div><p class="gmail-zw-paragraph" style="margin:0px 0px 0pt;line-height:1.2"><span class="gmail-EOP"> </span></p><div style="margin: 0px 0px 0pt; line-height: 1.2;" class=""><span style="font-family: Roboto; font-size: 12pt;" class="">Thank you for your response.</span></div><p class="gmail-zw-paragraph" style="margin:0px 0px 0pt;line-height:1.2"><span class="gmail-EOP"> </span></p><div style="margin: 0px 0px 0pt; line-height: 1.2;" class=""><span style="font-family: Roboto; font-size: 12pt;" class="">Members will be interested in your views on the recent revelation that suspended CEO of AFRINIC, Eddy, had sent a letter asking ATU to appoint directors for AFRINIC in an attempt to avoid member elect directors. This plea, coupled with the NRO letter seeking diplomatic immunity for AFRINIC, begs the question why not just let all RIR join the ITU?</span></div><p class="gmail-zw-paragraph" style="margin:0px 0px 0pt;line-height:1.2"><span class="gmail-EOP"> </span></p><div style="margin: 0px 0px 0pt; line-height: 1.2;" class=""><span style="font-family: Roboto; font-size: 12pt;" class="">You will got immunity from ITU or ATU or whichever governmental body that will appoint directors of RIR, and no member would ever be able to find justice in court.</span></div><p class="gmail-zw-paragraph" style="margin:0px 0px 0pt;line-height:1.2"><span class="gmail-EOP"> </span></p><div style="margin: 0px 0px 0pt; line-height: 1.2;" class=""><span style="font-family: Roboto; font-size: 12pt;" class="">The recent events and actions of AFRINIC and other RIR defies everything I, and some of the other members I was talking to, learned in this community. It goes against everything, that the bottom up and community driven approach that Rob told me on my first day of RIPE meeting a decade ago.</span></div><p class="gmail-zw-paragraph" style="margin:0px 0px 0pt;line-height:1.2"><span class="gmail-EOP"> </span></p><div style="margin: 0px 0px 0pt; line-height: 1.2;" class=""><span style="font-family: Roboto; font-size: 12pt;" class="">I hope to preserve the RIR system I grew up with. I hope you agree with that desire. At the end of the day, you were there when it was created and we need you to continue to fight for our independence from interference - regardless of where the requests for interference come from.</span></div><p class="gmail-zw-paragraph" style="margin:0px 0px 0pt;line-height:1.2"><span class="gmail-EOP"> </span></p><div style="margin: 0px 0px 0pt; line-height: 1.2;" class=""><span style="font-family: Roboto; font-size: 12pt;" class="">With regards</span></div><p class="gmail-zw-paragraph" style="margin:0px 0px 0pt;line-height:1.2"><span class="gmail-EOP"> </span></p><span style="font-family: Roboto; font-size: 12pt;" class="">Lu</span><br class=""></div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Jul 22, 2022 at 9:05 PM Hans Petter Holen <<a href="mailto:hph@ripe.net" class="">hph@ripe.net</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Dear all,<br class="">
<br class="">
I will respond where I can, although the RIPE NCC cannot speak for AFRINIC, and any statement on behalf of the NRO needs to be made jointly with the other four RIRs.<br class="">
<br class="">
First, I would like to address the concerns about the language used in the NRO letter to the Mauritian government. It was not written in a tone that we would use under ordinary circumstances. The letter could have been worded better in parts, and it obviously led to our message being misconstrued. We take note of this and will do better in this regard.<br class="">
<br class="">
Further, some of you have expressed concerns that this letter was an attempt by the NRO to interfere in the judicial processes of Mauritius. However, this was not the intention. As I said in my previous email, we simply wanted to lend weight to AFRINIC's request and help to ensure its ability to provide services to its members. In no way do we believe it is our place (or the NRO’s for that matter) to influence judicial processes in a sovereign nation. <br class="">
<br class="">
Coming to the issue of “international status” for RIRs, this status can mean different things under different jurisdictions. The RIPE NCC has not requested "international status" from any Dutch or international body. What such status might mean for AFRINIC would be for the Mauritian government to evaluate. For the RIPE NCC, you, our members, are the ultimate governing body, and any potential changes to our legal status would be made in consultation with you.<br class="">
<br class="">
I agree fully with comments that the issues with AFRINIC's governance need to be addressed and I want to reiterate that only the members of AFRINIC and the Internet community in Africa can resolve them. We encourage AFRINIC's members and community to contribute constructively to improve this situation.<br class="">
<br class="">
All our efforts have been guided by the desire to support the stability of the global RIR system, which as Lu correctly points out, is a global, bottom-up, community-driven project. This is how the Internet has been built and, we hope, will continue to be governed. <br class="">
<br class="">
Finally, this list is under moderation and we will continue to ensure that all mails that are put through to the list abide by the code of conduct.<br class="">
<br class="">
Sincerely,<br class="">
<br class="">
Hans Petter Holen<br class="">
Managing Director<br class="">
RIPE NCC<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
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