<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> <head> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"> <meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 14 (filtered medium)"> <style></style> </head> <body lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"> <div class="WordSection1"> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Me also please<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:red">Владимир Ѓуровски<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:red">Оддел за ИТ и ТК технологии<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">ЕВН Електродистрибуција ДООЕЛ<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">ул. „11 Октомври“ бр. 9, 1000 Скопје<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">T: +389 2 3205 300 – 4423</span><span lang="DE" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">2<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">M: +389 72 934 23</span><span lang="DE" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">2<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><a href="mailto:vladimir.gjurovski@evn.mk"><span lang="DE">vladimir.gjurovski</span><span lang="MK">@evn.mk</span></a></span><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><a href="http://www.evn.mk">www.evn.mk</a><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Користете ја енергијата разумно: помислете на животната средина пред да ја испечатите оваа електронска порака.<o:p></o:p></span></b></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:red">Vladimir Gjurovski<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:red">IT and TK technology Department<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">EVN Elektrodistribucija DOOEL<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">ul</span><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">. „11 </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Oktomvri</span><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">“ </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">no</span><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">. 9, 1000 </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Skopje<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="DE" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">T</span><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">: +389 2 3205 300 – 4423</span><span lang="DE" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">2<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="DE" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">M</span><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">: +389 72 934 23</span><span lang="DE" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">2<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><a href="mailto:vladimir.gjurovski@evn.mk"><span lang="DE">vladimir.gjurovski</span><span lang="MK">@evn.mk</span></a></span><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><a href="http://www.evn.mk">www.evn.mk</a><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="MK" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Use energy wisely: Please consider the environment before you print this email.</span></b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <div> <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm"> <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> members-discuss [mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net] <b>On Behalf Of </b>John Jeffery<br> <b>Sent:</b> Monday, May 14, 2018 1:46 PM<br> <b>To:</b> David Benwell; William; Bunea TELECOM<br> <b>Cc:</b> members-discuss@ripe.net<br> <b>Subject:</b> Re: [members-discuss] VL: IP transfer (in)security<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> <div id="divtagdefaultwrapper"> <p><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">guys can you take me off this email chain?<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">thanks v much<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p><span style="font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> </div> <div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"> <hr size="2" width="98%" align="center"> </div> <div id="divRplyFwdMsg"> <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"> members-discuss <<a href="mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net">members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net</a>> on behalf of David Benwell <<a href="mailto:dave@it-communicationsltd.co.uk">dave@it-communicationsltd.co.uk</a>><br> <b>Sent:</b> Monday, May 14, 2018 12:44:26 PM<br> <b>To:</b> William; Bunea TELECOM<br> <b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:members-discuss@ripe.net">members-discuss@ripe.net</a><br> <b>Subject:</b> Re: [members-discuss] VL: IP transfer (in)security</span> <o:p></o:p></p> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p> </div> </div> <div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">William, Would you happen to be such holder of address apace?</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm"> <p class="xmsonormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> members-discuss [<a href="mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net">mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>William<br> <b>Sent:</b> 14 May 2018 11:47<br> <b>To:</b> Bunea TELECOM <<a href="mailto:suport@bunea.eu">suport@bunea.eu</a>><br> <b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:members-discuss@ripe.net">members-discuss@ripe.net</a><br> <b>Subject:</b> Re: [members-discuss] VL: IP transfer (in)security</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">These are legacy. They are not RIR business.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">No RIR can reclaim them (and reclaim is plainly wrong, they never owned them, this is pre-RIR space), they are private property.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">Taking them is theft and nothing else, no matter how you phrase it.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">--</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">William Weber</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">Consulting, Security & Management - Tel-Aviv, Israel / Rijeka, Croatia</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><a href="https://ip6.im/" target="_blank">https://ip6.im</a> - No RIPE LIR? Still read this email for some reason? Grab a /40 *free* IPv6 space for BGP usage. Or just get it anyway, can't hurt to have.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="xmsonormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 12:27, Bunea TELECOM <<a href="mailto:suport@bunea.eu">suport@bunea.eu</a>> wrote:</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"> <div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">I agree,</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">There are tens of /8’s available, some of them even unannounced. For example there are lots of entities which if they would gave up (even partially) of their unused blocks, it would push the IPv4 complete exaustion to 2020+. </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">Thanks,</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">Petru</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black">—</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black"><br> <img border="0" width="63" height="73" id="x__x005f_x0000_i1025" src="cid:image001.jpg@01D3EB8C.98F61810"></span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black"><br> <br> <br> <br> <b>Petru Bunea</b> / CEO <br> <a href="mailto:suport@bunea.eu" target="_blank"><span style="color:#477CCC;text-decoration:none">suport@bunea.eu</span></a> / <a href="tel:+40752481282" target="_blank">+40752481282</a></span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <p class="xmsonormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#212121">Bunea TELECOM</span></b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:black"> / DATACENTER / APP DEVELOPMENT<br> <a href="http://www.bunea.eu/" target="_blank"><span style="color:#477CCC;text-decoration:none">http://www.bunea.eu</span></a> / <a href="tel:+40745495495" target="_blank">+40745495495</a></span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">On 14 May 2018, at 11:20, Janarthanan Sundaram <<a href="mailto:j.sundaram@123telcom.nl" target="_blank">j.sundaram@123telcom.nl</a>> wrote:</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I think we should prioritize on on point two: what to do with unused blocks.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm"> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Van:</span></b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> members-discuss <<a href="mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net" target="_blank">members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net</a>> <b>Namens </b>Bruno Carvalho<br> <b>Verzonden:</b> maandag 14 mei 2018 10:11<br> <b>Aan:</b> <a href="mailto:members-discuss@ripe.net" target="_blank">members-discuss@ripe.net</a><br> <b>Onderwerp:</b> Re: [members-discuss] VL: IP transfer (in)security</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> </div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <p class="xmsonormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">This discussion is quite interesting. But i think it should be discussed between all RiRs. Not only for RIPE.<br> When we look at big companies, like Microsoft, and do a simple scan of their assigned IP ranges... we found some /14 and several /16 unassigned/unused ranges.</span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif""><br> <br> <br> </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">Personnally, i think we should focus on 2 main things:</span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif""><br> <br> <br> </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">- Improve IPv6 implementation all over the territory (i know this is painfull for many LIRs because it implies additional work and purchase of new equipments. But let's face it. We are in 2018. If an equipment doesn't support IPv6, it's very obsolete and not performant).</span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif""><br> <br> <br> </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">- Check with the other RiRs what would be the best to do with those big unused ranges that are owned by companies that don't use them.</span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif""><br> <br> <br> </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">Regards</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">---</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="4" cellpadding="0"> <tbody> <tr> <td width="148" style="width:111.0pt;padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt"> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><img border="0" width="148" height="43" id="x__x005f_x0000_i1026" src="https://www.xrv.pt/templates/xrv/html/img/xrv.png" alt="XRV"><o:p></o:p></p> </div> </td> <td width="380" style="width:285.0pt;padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt"> <p class="xmsonormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Bruno Carvalho (CEO <a href="http://xrv.pt" target="_blank"> xrv.pt</a>) | +351 300 404 316<br> <span style="font-family:Webdings;color:#009900">P</span> <span style="font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#009900">Please consider the environment before printing this email</span><o:p></o:p></p> </td> <td width="64" style="width:48.0pt;padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt"> <p class="xmsonormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><a href="https://www.xrv.pt/" target="_blank" title="XRV"><span style="color:purple;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="53" height="32" id="x__x005f_x0000_i1027" src="https://www.xrv.pt/templates/xrv/html/img/www.png" alt="Visit our website"></span></a><br> <a href="https://www.facebook.com/xervers/" target="_blank" title="Visit us on Facebook"><span style="color:purple;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="32" height="32" id="x__x005f_x0000_i1028" src="https://www.xrv.pt/templates/xrv/html/img/facebook.png" alt="Facebook"></span></a><a href="https://twitter.com/xervers" target="_blank" title="Visit us on Twitter"><span style="color:purple;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="32" height="32" id="x__x005f_x0000_i1029" src="https://www.xrv.pt/templates/xrv/html/img/twitter.png" alt="Twitter"></span></a><o:p></o:p></p> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> </div> <p class="xmsonormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif""><br> <br> <br> </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">On 2018-05-14 09:51, Hans Govenius wrote:</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 5.0pt;margin-left:0cm;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt"> <div> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"">Hello<br> <br> Not needed IP = The addressese company is ready to sell for a small profit </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Segoe UI Symbol","sans-serif"">😊</span><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New""> ? This is probably good indication that its not used anymore. One option is to automatically block all and any IP transaction which does not involve transaction of the whole company/business. It is a question that can IP be a commodity. Now its a commodity that is getting more rare by the year. Maybe IP should be considered an jointly owned part of infrastructure which is deployed by need basis. (Socialistic way)<br> <br> Other option is to start to take money per IP. This would instantly mean that everyone would look up to own ip spaces. Let say it would cost 1 euro / year for a IP it would only be approx 1000 euros for the smallest allocation. Someone with 10 million IP addressese are likely to happily pay for it fi they are in use, but if they are not i would think they would be handed back. (Capitalistic way)<br> <br> One option is also to go with the current system because internet is working so its not horribly wrong at the moment either. <br> <br> One interesting this is tho that old LIR:s are likely to wanting to keep these things unchanged. New LIR:s are more likely to want changes as this is heavily favoring old LIR:s. And every year a proportionally larger part will be the ones with few IP:s and same vote than the one with alot of IP:s and also only 1 vote. <br> <br> Br. Hans <br> <br> <br> <br> <br> -----Alkuperäinen viesti-----<br> Lähettäjä: members-discuss <<a href="mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net</span></a>> Puolesta REG ID: pl.skonet<br> Lähetetty: maanantai 14. toukokuuta 2018 10.34<br> Vastaanottaja: <a href="mailto:pdonner@znak.fi" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">pdonner@znak.fi</span></a>; <a href="mailto:members-discuss@ripe.net" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">members-discuss@ripe.net</span></a><br> Aihe: Re: [members-discuss] VL: IP transfer (in)security<br> <br> W dniu 14.05.2018 o 09:25, Philip Donner pisze: </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 5.0pt;margin-left:0cm;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt"> <p class="xmsonormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New""><br> I would like to amplify Dave's good proposal, by suggesting that unused addresses should be handed back to RIPE, so that they can be added to a pool of addresses reserved for LIRs who needs them for non-profit promotion of IP networks.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </blockquote> <div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New""><br> Ok, but there is never ending story to resolve: how to define 'unused addresses'. Because not announced in BGP definitely != not used.<br> <br> -- <br> <br> Tomasz Śląski<br> pl.skonet<br> <br> <br> _______________________________________________<br> members-discuss mailing list<br> <a href="mailto:members-discuss@ripe.net" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">members-discuss@ripe.net</span></a><br> <a href="https://mailman.ripe.net/" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">https://mailman.ripe.net/</span></a><br> Unsubscribe: <a href="https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/options/members-discuss/hans.govenius%40devnet.fi" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/options/members-discuss/hans.govenius%40devnet.fi</span></a><br> _______________________________________________<br> members-discuss mailing list<br> <a href="mailto:members-discuss@ripe.net" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">members-discuss@ripe.net</span></a><br> <a href="https://mailman.ripe.net/" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">https://mailman.ripe.net/</span></a><br> Unsubscribe: <a href="https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/options/members-discuss/bruno.carvalho%40xrv.pt" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/options/members-discuss/bruno.carvalho%40xrv.pt</span></a></span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> </blockquote> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"">_______________________________________________<br> members-discuss mailing list<br> <a href="mailto:members-discuss@ripe.net" target="_blank">members-discuss@ripe.net</a><br> <a href="https://mailman.ripe.net/" target="_blank">https://mailman.ripe.net/</a><br> Unsubscribe: <a href="https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/options/members-discuss/suport%40bunea.eu" target="_blank"> https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/options/members-discuss/suport%40bunea.eu</a></span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </blockquote> </div> <p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> </div> </blockquote> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> <table> <tbody> <tr> <td> <div style="font-size:9pt; font-family: 'Arial',Calibri;">Напомена: Оваа порака и сите прилози што ги содржи се доверливи, заштитени и наменети само за испраќачот. Секое објавување, препраќање или користење на податоците е строго забрането за лицата на кои не им е наменета. Доколку ја имате добиено пораката по грешка, Ве молиме контактирајте го испраќачот и избришете ја. Испраќачот не превзема одговорност за несоодветно или нецелосно пренесување на информациите содржани во оваа комуникација, ниту пак за какво било задоцнување или настанати оштетувања како резултат на прием. </div> </td> </tr> <tr> <td>  </td> </tr> <tr> <td> <div style="font-size:9pt; font-family: 'Arial',Calibri;">Confidentiality Note: This message and any attached files are confidential and intended solely for the addressee. Any publication,transmission or other use of the information by a person or entity other than the intended addressee is prohibited. If you receive this in error please contact the sender and delete the material. The sender does not accept liability for any errors or omissions as a result of the transmission. </div> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> </body> </html>