<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> <head> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"> <meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)"> <style></style> </head> <body lang="DE" link="blue" vlink="purple"> <div class="WordSection1"> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">William,<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">while I don't feel competent enough to comment on the first part of your reply, I fully second the last paragraph!<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Oliver.<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <div> <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm"> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><b>Von:</b> members-discuss [mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net] <b>Im Auftrag von </b>William<br> <b>Gesendet:</b> Freitag, 13. April 2018 02:16<br> <b>An:</b> Aleksey Bulgakov <aleksbulgakov@gmail.com><br> <b>Cc:</b> members-discuss@ripe.net; agm@ripe.net<br> <b>Betreff:</b> Re: [members-discuss] [ncc-announce] [GM] RIPE NCC Annual Report 2017 and Proposed RIPE NCC Charging Scheme 2019<o:p></o:p></p> </div> </div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><o:p> </o:p></p> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">Must be some joke (i hope at least).<o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">Russia does not have staff needs available unless you pay excessive (skilled are in fact leaving anyway, we have a bunch of Russians working from Cyprus nowadays), Russia is not politically stable (a stable autocracy is not politically stable overall) and the currency fluctuates between basically worthless and entirely worthless.<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">Government control is excessive, freedom of business is low, growth is low, legal security is nil.... plus one more round of UN sanctions could cut off any RIPE member from paying invoices entirely.<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">Russia is in no way suitable for RIPE (and in fact, Bulgaria has less tax than Russia anyway + a much more simple tax system + EU).<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">In case of no joke... after speaking with some LIRs we'll boycott any attempts to move the NCC out of the EU and i assume from the statutes this requires a full member vote which is extremely unlikely to pass for Russia (or in practice anyone else).<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> </div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">--<o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">William Weber<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> </div> </div> </div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt"> <span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 01:39, Aleksey Bulgakov <<a href="mailto:aleksbulgakov@gmail.com">aleksbulgakov@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"> <div> <div> <div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt"> <span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><<a href="mailto:david.ponzone@ipeva.fr" target="_blank">david.ponzone@ipeva.fr</a>>:<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm"> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">AFAIK, social charges paid by the employer in NL are around 28%, so it's less than 3000 euros per month per staff member of income.<o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">And that's before social charges paid by the employee (18%), so it's less than 2500€ of net income per staff.<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">I would not judge if that's high or low in NL, but that's not 4000€<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> </blockquote> </div> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">So, we can move the RIPE office to another country, with less salary numbers. E.g. there are the salary numbers approximately 1500€ in Russia, including tax 13%. With social tax 30% the salary numbers are 2000€ in Moscow. <o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">What do you think about it? Me and my colleagues, who wrote here earlier, are ready to help the community with relocation.<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> </div> </div> </blockquote> </div> </div> </body> </html>