[members-discuss] [ncc-announce] [GM] Consultation on RIPE NCC Charging Scheme 2024

We have a relatively small deployment with a single LIR, single ASN , 
two IPv4 allocations and one IPv6 allocation.

Model 1 has me paying 28.2% more , €2,050
Model 2 has me paying 89.7% more.... €4,050

For a small provider.. that is a SIGNIFICANT price increase and burden 
for what is effectively a centralized database and verification service.

For what exactly are you telling me I am paying for with those increases?

Why has your budget grown to the point that you are worried about LIR 
accounts merging? Why are you not exploring other options by reducing 
your budget and being proper stewards of our money. Please do not forget 
that RIPE, as your own definition is a "We're a not-for-profit 
membership association, a Regional Internet Registry and the secretariat 
for the RIPE community supporting the Internet through technical 
coordination."

You are not for profit, and as such I would recommend instead of 
increasing the LIR pricing, we acknowledge that the world is a much 
tougher place and review not only the budget expenses of the 
organization but additional expenses that are not necessary. You're 
offering up to €250,000 per year funding projects with presumably our 
registration fee's and funds of which you selected 8 recipients, for a 
presumed funding of €2,000,000 of our funds..... If that program was cut 
or reduced, how much would that make up for your budget short fall?

Otherwise how about we also investigate other avenues of budget 
expenditure from RIPE and determine your total projected short fall.

Ripe appears to have Approx 190 Employees on payroll as well, but yet 
RIPE only has 23,397 LIR's and 20,244 members. That is a significantly 
high ratio of employee to members, - 106 Members per 1 employee - why is 
this so high, what audits have been conducted recently to ensure RIPE is 
not suffering from technical creep and employee bloat?

Your own budget for 2023 shows you've assigned less IPv4 resources in 
2021 and 2022 than in prior years and have completed significantly fewer 
registry checks. The only real increase seen has been in RPKI's created.

You're also projecting more trips this year than previous as well, a 10% 
increase. I'm sorry but this feels like a huge cash grab to maintain 
your current life style and I fully reject both Models. If I have more 
time I'll continue to dig into your financials and we can all have 
discussions on how as an organization you can be better stewards of our 
Money. You have to remember, at the end of the day your job is to manage 
a registry of finite resources. Spending money on events, trade shows, 
travel and excess employees is not a necessity to conduct your original 
goals and objectives.

The rest of the world, and all of the small companies who utilize your 
services often times do not have the liberty to simply talk about 
raising prices, especially in many of the economically impacted areas 
that RIPE services. RIPE should follow the same course of action as many 
of their customers do, evaluate internal expenditures and operate within 
the budget provided by your members, not come to the membership and 
request we continue to pay for donations to random projects, or a 10% 
increase in employee travel.

Sincerely
Daniel C Pearson
Private Systems Networks~







On 3/7/23 03:35, Simon Jan Haytink wrote:
> Dear RIPE NCC members,
>
> We would like to re-open the consultation we began with the membership in 2021 on the RIPE NCC Charging Scheme model, and we would like to carry out that consultation well in advance of the RIPE NCC General Meeting (GM) May 2023.
>
> In 2021, we presented on this topic at the GM, and we also surveyed our members and held an open house to get direct input on the charging scheme model that members would like to see implemented by the RIPE NCC. The outcome at that stage of the consultation was that there were strong cases made for both the current one-LIR, one-fee model and for a category-based model that would charge based on the number of resources held by a member. A strong case was also made to charge for all resources allocated or assigned by the RIPE NCC, including ASNs, and to charge a fee for transfers.
>
> The Executive Board decided to suspend the consultation in light of the war in Ukraine, but we are eager to decide on a way forward on this matter together with the membership.
>
> One of the main reasons that we would like to advance the discussion on the charging model is that we expect many members with multiple LIR accounts who received resources in 2021 to merge these accounts in the coming year. This means that the income the RIPE NCC receives will be reduced by a significant amount and we will need to ensure that our charging model allows us to collect the revenue required to maintain our operations. We believe that a category-based model would be best suited to cover this consolidation risk. Continuing with the existing model would mean that an increase in fees for all members would be required. Our ultimate goal is to arrive at a charging scheme model that will be sustainable for many years to come, meeting the needs of the RIPE NCC’s members.
>
> To help with discussion and to provide something tangible for members to assess, we are putting forward two draft models for members to review. These models can be summarised as:
>
> Model 1: A “one-LIR, one-fee” model based on the current RIPE NCC Charging Scheme 2023  that also charges for independent resources, ASNs, transfers and changes in business structure such as Mergers & Acquisitions.
>
> Model 2: A category-based model that charges per member (not per LIR account) and is based on resources registered and that also charges for independent resources, ASNs, transfers and changes in business structure such as Mergers & Acquisitions.
>
> In order to allow members to form an opinion based on their own situation, we are providing an Excel sheet that will allow you to calculate the fees you would pay under each of the draft models. It is important to be aware that at this stage, the numbers assigned for each item are indicative and would be reviewed in light of the discussion with members. We plan to review these figures following consultation with the members, and giving input on those figures would greatly help to arrive at a good model.
>
> You can download the Excel sheet from:
> https://www.ripe.net/participate/mail/member-and-community-consultations/member-calculator-charging-scheme-2024.xlsx
>
> We also plan to hold another Open House meeting on the Charging Scheme in March to further discuss the charging scheme models. The Executive Board will then take the input and decide on one or more charging schemes for the membership to vote on at the GM to be held on 24 May 2023. The outcome of that vote will determine the charging scheme model to be used in the coming years.
>
> I ask that you provide your input on this important consultation on the Membership Discussion mailing list (members-discuss at ripe.net) by 26 April. Input provided up to this date will be considered by the Board when formulating the charging schemes to be proposed for the GM. Input after this date is of course also welcome although it might not be reflected in the schemes put forward to the membership at the GM.
>
> The consultation will also be recorded and available from:
> https://www.ripe.net/participate/mail/member-and-community-consultations
>
> I look forward to your input.
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Simon Jan Haytink
> Finance Director
> RIPE NCC
>
> Summary
>
> 7 March: Start consultation with membership on RIPE NCC Charging Scheme model
> 21 March: Open House to discuss charging scheme with membership
> 24 March: Executive Board meeting to discuss input received so far
> 12 April: Publication of Draft RIPE NCC Charging Schemes 2024
> 26 April: Publication of Final RIPE NCC Charging Schemes to be voted on by members
> 24 May: RIPE NCC General Meeting May 2023
>
> References
>
> Open House and Survey Results
> https://www.ripe.net/participate/meetings/open-house/ripe-ncc-open-house-charging-scheme-principles
>
> Presentation at General Meeting
> https://www.ripe.net/participate/meetings/gm/meetings/may-2021/documentation-and-archive/ripe-ncc-charging-scheme-discussion.pdf
>
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