[members-discuss] [ncc-announce] [GM] Publication of Draft Charging Scheme Models 2024

Hi Simon,

I agree with Sergey, it is quite disappointing to see that all 3 models
include a 50 EUR/year charge for ASNs.
While I am not as opposed to it as including ASNs in the category
calculations, I do still think it has a chance to reduce the number of new
younger network engineers.
I won't go on too much about it again as I have already mentioned it before
but I first got involved with the RIPE NCC and RIPE community thanks to the
RIPE NCC not charging anything for ASNs. (and I am not the only one)
I do know that these ASNs have a cost to the RIPE NCC because of the
administrative work involved but I think that is a cost that is worth
accepting and financing through other fees.

Ben Cox posted about this[1] and I pretty much entirely agree with the
points he is making.

I urge the executive board to postpone this question for now (by removing
the ASN fee from all 3 proposed models) and have a new vote later once we
have decided on the other details of the charging scheme.
I feel like there are too many parameters currently for it to make sense as
one vote and this important detail might be overlooked.

Additionally I see that the proposed transfer fee is still 1000 EUR which
feels very high for resources that aren't IPv4.
Please consider limiting this fee to only IPv4 space or heavily reducing it
for IPv6 space and ASNs to 50 EUR or something.

[1]: https://benjojo.co.uk/u/benjojo/h/7Vt72t2jh48Djh7nSw

-Cynthia

On Thu, Apr 13, 2023 at 4:23 PM Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss <
members-discuss at ripe.net> wrote:

> Hi Simon,
>
> Thank you for the summary of proposed charging schemes.
>
> I only have a concern whether the ASN fee has received a rough approval
> from members. Is the AS number a limited resource, especially 32-bit ASNs?
> Is it valuable somehow?
>
> I would suggest to prepare a scheme without the ASN fee. And of course,
> members whose invoice amount will be increased should receive the quarterly
> payments benefit.
>
> PS. It's sad when the only option to keep the flat fee is don't approve
> all the proposed models.
>
> --
> Kind regards,
> Sergey Myasoedov
>
> > On Apr 12, 2023, at 09:45, Simon-Jan Haytink <simonjh at ripe.net> wrote:
> >
> > Dear RIPE NCC members,
> >
> > I want to thank all those who contributed to the consultation so far on
> the RIPE NCC Charging Scheme 2024 and the model we should use for the
> coming years.
> >
> > We can now share three draft models that we developed based on input
> from the members on the Members Discuss mailing list and in the Charging
> Scheme Open House, as well as from the discussions at the recent Executive
> Board Meeting.
> >
> > The result is that we are proposing three draft charging scheme models:
> one category-based and two that are based on the previous "one LIR account,
> one fee" model. We hope to receive feedback on these models by 19 April so
> the Executive Board can propose the final versions on 26 April. The members
> will then vote on those three models at the upcoming General Meeting on
> 24-26 May.
> >
> > The three models all aim to fulfil a budget that is roughly the same as
> 2023 plus general cost increases including inflation, so EUR 42-45 million.
> By doing this, we can ensure that we can meet the potential budgetary
> requirements for 2024 while retaining the option for members to
> redistribute any excess contributions should we receive excess funds. The
> Activity Plan and Budget will be discussed with members this coming Autumn.
> >
> > The three models are available to review at:
> >
> https://www.ripe.net/participate/mail/member-and-community-consultations/charging-scheme-2024-consultation
> >
> > We also provide an updated calculator where members can see for
> themselves how much they might pay under the draft models:
> >
> https://www.ripe.net/participate/mail/member-and-community-consultations/new-calculator-charging-scheme-2024.xlsx
> >
> > To summarise the main features of the three models:
> >
> > Model A - Category Model
> >
> > This model has ten categories to provide greater granularity. It also
> charges separately for independent and legacy resources in exactly the same
> way as in previous years. Additionally, a separate 50 EUR ASN assignment
> fee has been added. Both separately charged resources do not contribute to
> the category scores. This means there is no double charging and no specific
> charging for transfers or administrative work carried out by the RIPE NCC.
> There is a New /24 IPv4 administration fee to ensure there is a financial
> consequence to joining the IPv4 Waiting List. The fee would be payable upon
> receipt of the /24, and members joining the waiting list who do not have an
> eligible LIR account, would pay the new LIR sign-up fee to open a new LIR
> account and join the waiting list.
> >
> > With this model, approximately 68% of members would pay less than the
> current annual fee, with the remaining 32% paying more.
> >
> > The discussion with members helped us to see that a category-based model
> would receive significant support from members if the version was
> simplified. Should members see the need to charge for other elements, then
> that can be incorporated into the category model in the coming years. Any
> such additional charges could potentially then reduce the fees per category.
> >
> > Model B - Price increase and ASN fee
> >
> > This model is the exact same as in the previous ten years, but there is
> a price increase of EUR 150 and a 50 EUR ASN fee to ensure we can meet our
> budgetary requirements while retaining the option for members to
> redistribute any excess contribution should we receive excess funds.
> >
> > Model C - Transfer fee and ASN fee
> >
> > This model is the exact same as in the previous ten years, but there is
> a charge of EUR 1,000 per transfer to be paid by the receiving party and a
> 50 EUR ASN fee to ensure we can meet our budgetary requirements while
> retaining the option for members to redistribute any excess contribution
> should we receive excess funds.
> >
> > Further information on the charging scheme models is provided at:
> >
> https://www.ripe.net/participate/mail/member-and-community-consultations/charging-scheme-2024-consultation/
> >
> > The RIPE NCC Executive Board believes that a category-based model is the
> best option to help address uncertainty that might be caused by
> consolidation with multiple LIRs and to provide greater flexibility and
> fairness in how we charge members in the coming years.
> >
> > On 26 April, the final versions of the charging schemes that members
> will vote on will be published for the members to consider and discuss. If
> you have comments on the draft charging schemes, we therefore ask you to
> comment on the members-discuss mailing list by 19 April so we have time to
> incorporate any feedback if necessary.
> >
> > Importantly, we ask all members to register for the RIPE NCC General
> Meeting where the final decision will be in your hands. Register to
> participate and vote at:
> > https://my.ripe.net/#/meetings/active
> >
> > Simon-Jan Haytink
> > Chief Financial Officer
> > RIPE NCC
> >
>
>
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