[members-discuss] New Charging Scheme

Thu Jan 17 20:33:34 CET 2019

this sound a very nice approach that could clearly put all on the same 
plane: you can spend as you need ipv4 or you can return them if you 
don't use it...

Thomas

Il 17/01/19 14:30, ivaylo ha scritto:
>
> Hello, Jonas
>
> Thank you for the numbers ! In my previous mail told, that these are 
> examples only and pointed exact to this so now it is clear if the 
> charging scheme is on net basis:
>
> 26000000 (targeting budget) / 3108576 = 8.37 EUROs for /24 per year !
>
> Even if we put targeting budget x 2 it is very resonable fee for one 
> /24 net.
>
> Also permanent LIR to LIR resources transfers must be disabled. Then 
> what we will have:
> (again example numbers)
>
> registration fee: 2000 EURO Anual membership fee: 350 EURO (receive 
> one /24 for free)
> For every next /24 dedicated  + 10 EURO
>
> All LIR to LIR permanent transfers - disabled (If you need resources 
> ask RIPE, if you dont need return to RIPE)
>
> Off course bigger operators that need large resources will pay more 
> than now, but it is absolutely normal, they have larger bussiness with 
> a lot more revenue, It is not fair to put on same basis small telecom 
> with 2k-3k clients and operator with 20m - 30m clients.
>
>
> Ivaylo Josifov
> Varteh LTD
> Varna Bulgaria
>
>
> On Thu, 17 Jan 2019, Jonas Frey wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>> sorry but that type of billing is totally nonsense. You obvisously
>> never calculated this with real data. Let me do it for you:
>>
>> According to
>> ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/stats/delegated-ripencc-extended-latest
>> RIPE currently assigned 817101048 IP addresses for real-use (excluding
>> reserved and free etc.).
>> That equals to roughly 3191800 /24's. There are currently 20806 LIR's (
>> https://labs.ripe.net/statistics/number-of-lirs), if each one is
>> getting a /22 free, that means we have to deduct 83224 /24's from above
>> figure. That makes it 3108576 /24's which should be billed (according
>> to you).
>> 3108576*350 = 1.088.001.600,00 Euros. Yes, thats 1 billion euros.
>> RIPE's budget for 2018 was (projected) to be 26 million euros:
>> https://www.ripe.net/publications/docs/ripe-693
>>
>> As you can see this is utterly nonsense. As you might know, any surplus
>> the RIPE NCC generates (at the end of the fiscal year) will be re-
>> distributed to the members as RIPE is a association and not a company
>> in regular terms.
>>
>> Or are you trying to actually get paid from RIPE for using little count
>> of IPv4 addresses?
>>
>> Anything that is money related will *not* help to get IPv4 back or
>> solve this with the current form of membership and RIPE. There are
>> plenty of other ways (some of which have been proposed here) that are a
>> much better idea (migrating to IPv6 being the ultimate one).
>>
>> -J
>>
>>
>>
>> Am Mittwoch, den 16.01.2019, 17:22 +0200 schrieb ivaylo:
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> I 100% agree with you !
>>>
>>> As many resources one LIR consumes as bigger membership fee should
>>> be.
>>>
>>> Even to better optimize resources usage, the fee can be calculated on
>>> /24
>>> basis.
>>>
>>> example:
>>> /17 = 128 x /24
>>> fee = (128-4)*350 = 43 400 euro/year fee
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> P.S. in your example should be: (32-1)*1400 = 39 200 euro.
>>>
>>> Ivaylo Josifov
>>> Varteh LTD
>>> Varna Bulgaria
>>>
>>> On Wed, 16 Jan 2019, TrustHost wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi.
>>>>
>>>> I think it would be great if the payment depends on the quantity
>>>> the
>>>> resources for one account. It would help to return unused IPv4 in
>>>> free pool
>>>> for new business. The companies, who really use big networks won't
>>>> notice
>>>> such changes. But who received the resources before 2012 and has
>>>> unused /19
>>>> and maybe more will think if they really need such big blocks.
>>>>
>>>> For example we can implement the next charging scheme.
>>>> If one account has more than /20 (not equivalent 4x/22 or the
>>>> blocks were
>>>> allocated before 2012) the next /22 ownership will cost some price
>>>> (e.g.
>>>> 1400 euro).
>>>>
>>>> For example:
>>>> There is /17 IPv4 block for one LIR account.
>>>> /17 = 32x/22.
>>>> The total price for this account is (32-4)*1400 = 39 200 euro.
>>>>
>>>> I think the members must have equal rights, regardless of the year
>>>> of the
>>>> membership started.
>>>>
>>>> ------------------
>>>> Kind regards,
>>>> Boris Loginov
>>>>
>>>> TrustHost LLC
>>>>
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>>> ipe%40probe-networks.de
>
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