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[members-discuss] Request to update the SSA - Article 2.2, acceptance of documents
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Lu Heng
h.lu at outsideheaven.com
Mon Jun 25 17:20:05 CEST 2018
Hi On Mon, Jun 25, 2018 at 23:18 William <william at william.si> wrote: > I am absolutely against NOT sending by postal mail to sign but FOR > allowing to return by mail/digital. > > There are already LIRs with fake eg. Belize and African company documents, > if we now send nothing to nowhere anymore this will just get worse > Guess how much a fake P.O. box cost, just google:) > . > > This address sent to is also the only legal trace RIPE has - paid > anonymous, with fake data and no address needed this is heaven for > cybercrime - i'd love it, preventing all this BS would make me so much more > money. > > Also, RIPE is not just EU - a digital signature is not worth shit in like > Iran. > for country do not support digital signatures require by post > DocuSign and similar are NOT accepted services in such countries, thus the > signature is plainly invalid. > > -- > William Weber > > > > On Mon, Jun 25, 2018 at 13:21, Elvis Daniel Velea <elvis at v4escrow.net> > wrote: > > Erik, > > you have my support for the request below. > > @all - sorry for the top post > > /elvis > > On Wed, Apr 25, 2018 at 01:37 Erik Bais <ebais at a2b-internet.com> wrote: > > Dear members, > I like to open a discussion to have the SSA updated into this century .. > to allow for acceptance of the documents to be send in via the RIPE NCC > Portal ( with SSO ) or send in by email after being signed, or the RIPE NCC > to use a method of digital signature like the usage of DocuSign, Echosign > or something similar. > The acceptance of a digital signature has been allowed by EU law since > December 1999, ( EU Directive 99/93/EG - > <http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/ALL/?uri=CELEX:31999L0093> > http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/ALL/?uri=CELEX:31999L0093 ) > and implemented in Dutch law since 2003 ( > <http://wetten.overheid.nl/BWBR0015046/2003-05-21> > http://wetten.overheid.nl/BWBR0015046/2003-05-21 ) > We are currently in 2018 and the SSA still refers to a device that most of > our children never heard of or have seen ..... named a fax machine… > <snip> > <https://www.ripe.net/publications/docs/ripe-673> > https://www.ripe.net/publications/docs/ripe-673 > Article 2 – General > 2.1 The RIPE NCC Standard Service Agreement shall come into effect by > means of an offer and an acceptance. > 2.2 To enter into the RIPE NCC Standard Service Agreement, the following > documents have to be sent to the RIPE NCC by post or fax: > · One copy of the RIPE NCC Standard Service Agreement containing > the handwritten signature of an authorised representative of the Member > · A recent extract from the Commercial Trade Register or > equivalent document proving the registration of the Member with the > national authorities. > Upon receipt of these documents by the RIPE NCC, the RIPE NCC Standard > Service Agreement is considered to be concluded. The RIPE NCC shall not > commence the provision of the RIPE NCC services until these documents have > been received. Conclusion of the RIPE NCC Standard Service Agreement > establishes a RIPE NCC membership. > </snip> > While most of the fax implementations these days, including the one at the > RIPE NCC office, is a device that stores an image copy of a document on a > server. Not many companies have a paper print fax anymore these days.. > That document from those fax or multi-copier devices can then be printed > by the local printer or stored digitally in a database attached to a LIR > application as an attachment. Similar as if someone would scan the signed > SSA and email the document .. > However the current wording in the SSA doesn’t allow for that type of > scenario .. and it should be updated to a more neutral wording to allow a > better usage of technology. > If we can sign for a mortgage application in The Netherlands using a > digital signature, why can’t we apply for a new LIR with a digital > signature. > This will also allow for a much smoother new members to complete their > application .. > Using digital signatures will reduce the fees to DHL, speed up the > complete on-boarding process and reduce the handling fees at the RIPE > office. > <sarcasm> > For those that like to keep doing things, like we always did .. The city > of Amsterdam is also in the process to dis-allow the usage of horse and > carriage in the city. > So if someone would like to take a ride by horse carriage to the postal > office and use their fax machine there .. that is something that you cannot > do for a long time anymore as well … > <https://www.volkskrant.nl/binnenland/na-bierfiets-is-het-ook-einde-verhaal-voor-paardenkoets-in-centrum-amsterdam~a4580876/> > https://www.volkskrant.nl/binnenland/na-bierfiets-is-het-ook-einde-verhaal-voor-paardenkoets-in-centrum-amsterdam~a4580876/ > > </sarcasm> > And for countries that don’t allow the usage of digital signatures or > members that don’t want to use the new digital signature system, there is > always the option to request the paper SSA to be send via DHL and have it > signed and returned. Similar as we are currently also allowing those > options for invoices … > > Kind regards, > Erik Bais > _______________________________________________ > members-discuss mailing list > members-discuss at ripe.net > https://mailman.ripe.net/ > Unsubscribe: > https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/options/members-discuss/elvis%40v4escrow.net > > -- > Elvis Daniel Velea > V4Escrow LLC > Chief Executive Officer > E-mail: elvis at v4escrow.net > Mobile: +1 (702) 970 0921 > > Excuse the briefness of this mail, it was sent from a mobile device. > > _______________________________________________ > members-discuss mailing list > members-discuss at ripe.net > https://mailman.ripe.net/ > Unsubscribe: > https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/options/members-discuss/h.lu%40outsideheaven.com > -- This transmission is intended solely for the addressee(s) shown above. It may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise protected from disclosure. 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