<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class="">Hello Daniel,<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Thanks for your extensive response.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Unless I’ve overlooked it, we did not include a mention of the proposed</div><div class="">CoC response guide in the mail to ripe-list, which answers some of</div><div class="">your questions, and I’ve responded to more things below.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">The most recent draft of the response guide is on:</div><div class=""><a href="https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gaLo4axYDRTpQnhUJyG92EHBmEIkxSDN8Urmy-zn9nQ/edit?usp=sharing" class="">https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gaLo4axYDRTpQnhUJyG92EHBmEIkxSDN8Urmy-zn9nQ/edit?usp=sharing</a></div><div class=""><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div class="">Instead, I suggest to a call on everyone in the community to actively<br class="">intervene when they observe inappropriate behavior and to help all<br class="">parties concerned to resolve the situation.</div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div><div>Although this is a good message in general, it is in my experience</div><div>unlikely to have much effect. Speaking up, even if you are not the</div><div>person directly affected by the incident, is a big step. It always involves</div><div>some danger, especially when the person creating harm is in a position</div><div>of power. The bystander effect also comes into play.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>I would definitely be unlikely to speak up, because it’s usually too risky,</div><div>and has too little chance to make a difference. Especially at a RIPE</div><div>meeting right now, due to lack of an effective CoC process.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Also, “helping all parties to resolve the situation” is risky language,</div><div>as it places a responsibility on the person being harmed to contribute</div><div>to resolving the situation. In some incidents this may be appropriate,</div><div>but in CoC teams I’ve been a part of, a fundamental point of all the</div><div>process is that we place as little burden on the reporter as possible.</div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div class="">I suggest to maintain the current system of trusted contacts for<br class="">reporting violations and add that staff and volunteers such as chairs<br class="">and PC are also available. Where, by the way, is the evidence that this<br class="">is not sufficient? Maybe the trusted contacts can provide some sort of<br class="">transparency report to us?<br class=""></div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div>Well, currently I wouldn’t consider reporting a CoC incident at a RIPE</div><div>meeting, because why would I? None of the people you list are actually</div><div>empowered to take any action, other than offer sympathies.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>And how will these people make decisions? If I make a CoC report, will</div><div>it be discussed by the entire PC, all chairs, and trusted contacts together?</div><div>That is way too many people, and introduces many problems.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>If you empower these people to actually take action, up to the unusually</div><div>rare action of immediate removal from the conference, how does it solve</div><div>the concerns you raise about a CoC team?</div><div><br class=""></div><div>On a sidenote, this would also involve a requirement for training all PC</div><div>members, WG chairs, and trusted contacts at CoC incident response.</div><div><br class=""></div><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div class="">Further I recommend to develop a response plan that defines who is<br class="">responsible to take action in cases where individuals do not stop<br class="">inappropriate behavior once it is pointed out to them.</div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div>Are you saying that people should always, in every incident, first have</div><div>the behaviour pointed out, then re-violate, before more serious action</div><div>can be taken?</div><div><br class=""></div><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div class="">These<br class="">responsibilities do exist today within our governance structure. They<br class="">are shared between RIPE, RIPE NCC and third parties such as the<br class="">owners/operators of our venues. Maybe this needs to be clarified and we<br class="">may need to establish roles within these structures that are responsible<br class="">to follow up on any actions.</div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div><div>I’d argue that the current CoC process has way too many people kind of</div><div>responsible, and therefore in the end nobody responsible. In the current</div><div>situation, nobody has sufficient power, is able to act with sufficient speed,</div><div>provide sufficient confidentiality, and has expertise, to deal with incidents.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>As an example, I reported a CoC incident about 7 months ago now, and</div><div>have still not received a response other than a number of apologies for</div><div>not sending a response. This is exactly due to the lack of process and</div><div>clear responsibility.</div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div class="">But let us not create a new committee whose<br class="">sole purpose is to sanction community members without any process!<br class=""></div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div><div>I think this is partially addressed by the response guide linked above,</div><div>which we should have published along with the CoC process. Perhaps</div><div>this needs amendments. But the new proposal has much more process</div><div>behind it than the current setup.</div></div><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div class="">We should also make it clear that we do not tolerate any abuse of the<br class="">code of conduct itself. I realise that can be interpreted as<br class="">off-putting. However it is an essential part of such a code.<br class=""></div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div>Do you have a suggested wording for this? I have intentionally avoided</div><div>this in the past, because it risks discouraging reports, and getting</div><div>people to report incidents is one of the hardest parts.</div></div><div><br class=""></div><div>Sasha</div><div><br class=""></div></body></html>