<html xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)"><style></style></head><body lang=ES link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>I think we all need to re-read, from time to time, RFC7282.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=ES-TRAD style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span lang=ES-TRAD style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Jordi<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span lang=ES-TRAD style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>@jordipalet<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span lang=ES-TRAD style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=ES-TRAD style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=ES-TRAD style='font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>El 9/5/20 18:21, "anti-abuse-wg en nombre de Sérgio Rocha" <<a href="mailto:anti-abuse-wg-bounces@ripe.net">anti-abuse-wg-bounces@ripe.net</a> en nombre de <a href="mailto:sergio.rocha@makeitsimple.pt">sergio.rocha@makeitsimple.pt</a>> escribió:<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Hi everyone<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Otherwise we change the way the working Groups works it will remain unchanged for ever. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>I agree that we must get a way to vote or another democratic way to get decisions.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>If we don't change something in the process it better close this mailing lists that only exist to give the fake image that the community it's working<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>SR<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div id="composer_signature"><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><span style='font-size:9.5pt;color:#575757'>Enviado a partir do meu smartphone Samsung Galaxy.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>-------- Mensagem original --------<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>De : Carlos Friaças via anti-abuse-wg <anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Data: 09/05/20 13:41 (GMT+00:00) <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Para: Suresh Ramasubramanian <ops.lists@gmail.com> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Cc: Gert Doering <gert@space.net>, anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'>Assunto: [anti-abuse-wg] About "consensus" and "voting"... <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:35.4pt'><br>Hi Suresh, Gert, All,<br><br>"member organizations represented by" -- this only happens at the RIPE NCC <br>GM, twice a year.<br><br>The PDP doesn't happen at the RIPE NCC GM, afaik, whether we like it or <br>not.<br><br>When polarisation is obvious, "consensus" is impossible and everything <br>tend to remain as is...<br><br>Cheers,<br>Carlos<br><br><br>On Sat, 9 May 2020, Suresh Ramasubramanian wrote:<br><br>> <br>> In a case where the community is polarised to this extent it would be better to break with procedure and call a vote for once.? With member organizations represented by their abuse team heads, rather than IP / routing people, so that<br>> the organisation?s stance on this is clear.<br>> <br>> ?<br>> <br>> From: Gert Doering <gert@space.net><br>> Date: Saturday, 9 May 2020 at 3:57 PM<br>> To: Suresh Ramasubramanian <ops.lists@gmail.com><br>> Cc: Randy Bush <randy@psg.com>, Nick Hilliard <nick@foobar.org>, anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net <anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net><br>> Subject: Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 Discussion Phase (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")<br>> <br>> Hi,<br>> <br>> On Sat, May 09, 2020 at 01:12:32AM +0000, Suresh Ramasubramanian wrote:<br>> > Has this even been put to a vote or is it the same group of extremely vocal RIPE regulars against it and the same group of extremely vocal security types for it??? Rough consensus has its limitations in such cases.<br>> <br>> There is no voting.<br>> <br>> It's either "there is sufficient support and counterarguments have been<br>> adequately addressed" or "no consensus, rewrite or withdraw".<br>> <br>> Gert Doering<br>> ??????? -- NetMaster<br>> --<br>> have you enabled IPv6 on something today...?<br>> <br>> SpaceNet AG????????????????????? Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer<br>> Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14??????? Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann<br>> D-80807 Muenchen???????????????? HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen)<br>> Tel: +49 (0)89/32356-444???????? USt-IdNr.: DE813185279<br>> <br>> <br>> <o:p></o:p></p></div><br>**********************************************<br> IPv4 is over<br> Are you ready for the new Internet ?<br> http://www.theipv6company.com<br> The IPv6 Company<br> <br> This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited and will be considered a criminal offense. If you are not the intended recipient be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited, will be considered a criminal offense, so you must reply to the original sender to inform about this communication and delete it.<br> <br> </body></html>