<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> <head> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> <meta name="ProgId" content="Word.Document"> <meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 15"> <meta name="Originator" content="Microsoft Word 15"> <link rel="File-List" href="cid:filelist.xml@01D21029.969841F0"><link rel="Edit-Time-Data" href="cid:editdata.mso"><style></style> </head> <body lang="EN-GB" link="#0563C1" vlink="#954F72" style="tab-interval:36.0pt"> <div class="WordSection1"> Hi All,<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> I know it’s slightly off topic, but does anyone have any contacts who might be willing/able to discuss/review the (I think) excessive number of DNS lookups in their SPF records (like a mail service customer might “include:” in their own SPF record)?<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> The problem is that if you are a customer of more than one of these suppliers, and you include their SPF record in your SPF record, it’s too easy to breach the 10 DNS lookup limit, which could lead to random email loss (recipient MTAs giving up on DNS lookups and bouncing/rejecting legit mails). An example of unnecessary nested includes, the _spf.google.com TXT record(s), expanded: -<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> _spf.google.com descriptive text "v=spf1 include:_netblocks.google.com include:_netblocks2.google.com include:_netblocks3.google.com ~all"<o:p></o:p> _netblocks.google.com descriptive text "v=spf1 ip4:64.18.0.0/20 ip4:64.233.160.0/19 ip4:66.102.0.0/20 ip4:66.249.80.0/20 ip4:72.14.192.0/18 ip4:74.125.0.0/16 ip4:108.177.8.0/21 ip4:173.194.0.0/16 ip4:207.126.144.0/20 ip4:209.85.128.0/17 ip4:216.58.192.0/19 ip4:216.239.32.0/19 ~all"<o:p></o:p> _netblocks2.google.com descriptive text "v=spf1 ip6:2001:4860:4000::/36 ip6:2404:6800:4000::/36 ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36 ip6:2800:3f0:4000::/36 ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36 ip6:2c0f:fb50:4000::/36 ~all"<o:p></o:p> _netblocks3.google.com descriptive text "v=spf1 ip4:172.217.0.0/19 ~all"<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> These SPF records are perfectly able to live in a single, long DNS record (longer than 255 characters - simply by separating them with '" " ' (an end quote, a space, a start quote and a space) - these breaks are not seen in the final record - See: <a href="https://kb.isc.org/article/AA-00356/0/Can-I-have-a-TXT-or-SPF-record-longer-than-255-characters.html"> https://kb.isc.org/article/AA-00356/0/Can-I-have-a-TXT-or-SPF-record-longer-than-255-characters.html</a><o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> You can easily check the number of lookups an SPF record includes, using <a href="http://mxtoolbox.com/SuperTool.aspx?action=spf#">http://mxtoolbox.com/SuperTool.aspx?action=spf#</a> and I’ve created some test subdomains off my personal domain, so I can demo the issue & show that the multi-include SPF records, can be a single DNS record. I’ve padded-out my record with my own DNS lookups, so the number is right for the demo.<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> spf-bad.furrie.net descriptive text “v=spf1 a mx a:home.furrie.net a:office.furrie.net a:remote.furrie.net ip4:82.38.144.35 include:_spf.google.com include:mailgun.org -all”<o:p></o:p> SPF Included Lookups Too many included lookups (13)<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> I’ve created local records that duplicate the google and mailgun SPF records, but each service in a single record, separated into <255 character sections (note the breaks, which are not seen in the final record): -<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> spf-google.furrie.net descriptive text “v=spf1 ip4:64.18.0.0/20 ip4:64.233.160.0/19 ip4:66.102.0.0/20 ip4:66.249.80.0/20 ip4:72.14.192.0/18 ip4:74.125.0.0/16 ip4:108.177.8.0/21 ip4:173.194.0.0/16 ip4:207.126.144.0/20 ip4:209.85.128.0/17 ip4:216.58.192.0/19 ip4:216.239.32.0/19" " ip6:2001:4860:4000::/36 ip6:2404:6800:4000::/36 ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36 ip6:2800:3f0:4000::/36 ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36 ip6:2c0f:fb50:4000::/36 ip4:172.217.0.0/19 ~all”<o:p></o:p> spf-mailgun.furrie.net descriptive text “v=spf1 ip4:173.193.210.32/27 ip4:50.23.218.192/27 ip4:174.37.226.64/27 ip4:208.43.239.136/30 ip4:184.173.105.0/24 ip4:184.173.153.0/24 ip4:104.130.122.0/23 ip4:209.61.151.0/24 ip4:166.78.68.0/22 ip4:198.61.254.0/23 ip4:192.237.158.0/23" " ip4:23.253.182.0/24 ip4:23.253.183.0/24 ip4:104.130.96.0/28 -all”<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> spf-good.furrie.net descriptive text “v=spf1 a mx a:home.furrie.net a:office.furrie.net a:remote.furrie.net ip4:82.38.144.35 include:spf-google.furrie.net include:spf-mailgun.furrie.net -all”<o:p></o:p> SPF Included Lookups Number of included lookups is OK<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> The following are just a few examples that I’ve come across, this week: -<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> _spf.google.com - SPF contains 3 additional includes<o:p></o:p> spf.messagelabs.com - SPF contains 2 additional includes<o:p></o:p> spf.protection.outlook.com - SPF contains 2 additional includes<o:p></o:p> _spf.salesforce.com - SPF contains 1 additional include<o:p></o:p> mailgun.org - SPF contains 2 additional includes<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> There appears to be absolutely no need for any of these domain’s SPF (TXT) records to have any nested “include:” elements - they can all be created as single TXT records, with appropriate breaks in the record, to keep them <255 characters per section. Even the monster Google record’s resultant DNS lookup result is well under the old 512 byte UDP limit.<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> Anyway, thanks for reading, if you did.<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> Kind Regards,<o:p></o:p> --<o:p></o:p> <table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="807" style="width:605.25pt;border-collapse:collapse;mso-yfti-tbllook:1184;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm"> <tbody> <tr style="mso-yfti-irow:0;mso-yfti-firstrow:yes;mso-yfti-lastrow:yes"> <td width="49" valign="bottom" style="width:36.75pt;padding:0cm 15.0pt 0cm 0cm"> <a href="http://www.inty.com/" target="''"><img border="0" width="105" height="80" id="_x0000_i1031" src="http://intycascade.com/intycascade.png" alt="http://intycascade.com/intycascade.png"></a><o:p></o:p> </td> <td width="330" nowrap="" valign="bottom" style="width:247.5pt;padding:0cm 7.5pt 0cm 0cm"> <span style="font-size:12.0pt;mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri;mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New 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