<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>Hi,</div><div><br></div><div>If RIPE would enforce (just like with asn) the announcement of received /22s within a period of 1-2 months after the allocation, hoarding would be stopped. The sellers would not be able to advertise them as "brand new never used", as this detail gives them the most of their value. </div><div>Also, reinforcing the need of justification for requesting the /22, would slow the hoarders, as they would need to come up with (verifyable) justification.</div><div><br></div><div>There were lots of valid points against this policy, because it does not address the real problem, and moreso, RIPE NCC directly said that in their opinion it will have no effect over the small hoarding that is going on now. Please read the RIPE NCC impact analysis and you will see this.<br><br>Matei Storch<div>Profisol Telecom</div><div>0728.555.004</div></div><div><br>On 9 iun. 2015, at 23:18, Marius Catrangiu <<a href="mailto:catrangiumarius@gmail.com">catrangiumarius@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div dir="ltr">I fully support this (mail from <span alt="" class="" title="">opteamax</span> gmbh) point of view! and, of course the policy proposal.<br>
In my opinion <span alt="" class="" title="<div class='glt-header'>it's</div>= "it is" or "its"?">it's</span> a bad thing that RIPE did not have strong (backed up with strong detection of unused pools) policies even from the start.<br>
Thinks are <span alt="" class="" title="<div class='glt-header'>very</div>(use sparingly; try to use words that are strong in themselves for emphasis)">very</span> complicated and i get that, problems can't be foreseen in future and <span alt="" class="" title="<div class='glt-header'>it's</div>= "it is" or "its"?">it's</span> <span alt="" class="" title="<div class='glt-header'>easy</div>(weak definition)">easy</span> to judge now how thins <span alt="" class="" title="<div class='glt-header'>could</div>(do not confuse with "may")">could</span> be made easier/simpler but <span alt="" class="" title="<div class='glt-header'>it's</div>= "it is" or "its"?">it's</span> not late to start somewhere.<br>
Another opinion/impression that i have (and this does not <span alt="" class="" title="<div class='glt-header'>affect</div>"Affect" means "have an influence on", "produce an effect on", "concern", "effect a change in"; compare with "effect": "bring about", "cause", "produce, "result in."">affect</span> <span alt="" class="" title="<div class='glt-header'>only</div>Put "only" right before the word it modifies.">only</span> RIPE region) is that big providers and content providers do not want <span alt="" class="" title="<div class='glt-header'>ipv6</div>Did you mean:<br>IV<br />iv<br />IPA<br />Irv<br />">ipv6</span> to be implemented because behind <span alt="" class="" title="<div class='glt-header'>thoese</div>Did you mean:<br>these<br />those<br />thees<br />thous<br />thews<br />">thoese</span> guys are big interests of making profits over the <span alt="" class="" title="<div class='glt-header'>ipv4</div>Did you mean:<br>IV<br />iv<br />IPA<br />Irv<br />">ipv4</span> <span alt="" class="" title="<div class='glt-header'>exaution</div>Did you mean:<br>exaction<br />exertion<br />equation<br />execution<br />vexation<br />">exaution</span> and this happened as you saw in Romania (Jump Management) too.</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 10:57 PM, Opteamax GmbH <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ripe@opteamax.de" target="_blank">ripe@opteamax.de</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><span class=""><br>
On <a href="tel:09.06.2015%2019" value="+40906201519">09.06.2015 19</a>:54, Ciprian Nica wrote:><br>
> Come up with a proposal that will really stop this kind of activity and<br>
> I'll fully support it.<br>
<br>
</span>The only proposal which would actually fully stop this is actually<br>
refusing Prefix-Transfers completely and enforce returning to the RIPE-Pool.<br>
<br>
The only chance for taking-over Resources then should be a real "merge"<br>
of two LIR including the demand of their individual customers justifying<br>
why it is important to not being renumbered ... That kind of proposal<br>
would actually remove a lot of "profit-making" for brokers etc. on one<br>
hand, but on the other hand it offers the opportunity to the ones really<br>
needing IPv4-Space to get their need fullfilled by RIPE... at least if<br>
that kind of proposal would also enforce withdrawing IP-space which is<br>
not being really used for a while.<br>
<br>
Actually if that'd be done world-wide with all address-space not<br>
publicly routed - and therefore easily to replace with <a href="http://10.0.0.0/8" target="_blank">10.0.0.0/8</a> - we'd<br>
have sufficient IPv4 for the next decades ... Just a brief look into the<br>
routing-table on my router and I see 10 complete /8 (so called public<br>
IP-Space-prefixes) which are completely not announced and another 4 /8<br>
with less then one /21 announced.... and I do not want to know how many<br>
of the large /8 to /14 announcements are actually routed into a<br>
blackholes, as there are no real users on large parts of those nets.<br>
<br>
... and we discuss about /22 nets being "hoarded"?<br>
<br>
Sorry, could not resist to point on that.<br>
<br>
Still I support the proposal because it reduces the win for abusers and<br>
raises the risk that the now "hoarded" addresses are less worth when<br>
they are sellable. Hey, it is on us to make IPv4-Prefixes worthless.<br>
<br>
Best regards<br>
<br>
--<br>
Jens Ott<br>
<br>
Opteamax GmbH<br>
<br>
Simrockstr. 4b<br>
53619 Rheinbreitbach<br>
<br>
Tel.: +49 2224 969500<br>
Fax: +49 2224 97691059<br>
Email: <a href="mailto:jo@opteamax.de">jo@opteamax.de</a><br>
<br>
HRB: 23144, Amtsgericht Montabaur<br>
Umsatzsteuer-ID.: DE264133989<br>
<br>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature">Catrangiu Marius<br>Mobil: 0770481857<br>Mail: <a href="mailto:catrangiumarius@gmail.com" target="_blank">catrangiumarius@gmail.com</a></div>
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