[address-policy-wg] Millions of Internet Addresses Are LyingIdle

Shane and all,

  See my response/remarks interspersed below...

Shane Kerr wrote:

> Jeffrey,
>
> On Wed, 2008-10-15 at 00:13 -0700, Jeffrey A. Williams wrote:
> > All,
> >
> >   Seems that all the hub bub regarding IPv4 address space being
> > very limited is really not so.  As I and others have advocated
> > for years, reclaiming unused IPv4 space is needed.
> >
> > See:
> > The most comprehensive scan of the entire internet for several decades
> >  http://www.technologyreview.com/web/21528/ shows that millions of
> > allocated addresses simply aren't being used.
>
> Reclaiming unused IPv4 space is very expensive. The RIR system was never
> designed with reclamation in mind, and fear or selfishness on the part
> of existing participants has prevented even small moves towards fixing
> this (see discussions of 2007-01 for more insight).

  Sorry I don't except you premise that reclaiming unused IPv4 space is very
expensive.  Certainly your right that the early on allocation system was
grossly ill conceived, I remember I was there and argued frequently
with Jon Postel in this area.  2007-01 does not demonstrate the proper
time frame for relevant insight.

>
>
> What this means is, even if the space is available to be reclaimed the
> costs for getting IPv4 space will be much, much higher than today.

Compared to what time frame, and again why?  Simply stating something
does not make it so or even reasonable.  More justification for this
statement is needed.

> The
> idea of a market may help to lower these costs (or not), but the costs
> will still be there. Any time you see a change in a fundamental resource
> after decades of relatively low cost, there will be economic upset(*).

I agree very generally with your last sentence here.  Not your first,
however.  Any "Market" where IP address space is auctioned off
like a comodity will early on sore in price, than maybe later graduate
down or flatten out.  But this depends if the "Market" is regulated or
not, and if so, how it is regulated, whom is the regulator, and how
diligent that or those regulators are to adhering to the yet to be
determined regulations by which that "Market" operates under.

>
>
> When you into a black hole, nothing magical happens when you cross the
> event horizon. But your situation is very different. Likewise, when the
> last IPv4 address is allocated from the IANA to an RIR, no immediate
> catastrophe will happen, but the rules of the game will have changed.

True.  But first in this instance, if no reclaiming of IPv4 address space
is accomplished, and there is not defined "Market" than the stability
of the legacy internet is under siege and ripe, pardon the pun, for
mischief.

  Maybe I should consider a new form of dirivitive, something like
an IPvswap and take the IMF up on their graciously termed loan to better
market IPv8?  >:)  At least this way it will be a unregulated market for
a while ( several years ), IPv4 address space will become nearly worthless
in terms of $$ value, and IPv6 will get a boost in acceptance, while
all the while the loan will be eventually paid by large EU IPv4 holders.

Regards,

Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 281k members/stakeholders strong!)
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>
>
> --
> Shane
>
> (*) For example:
>     http://blog.wired.com/cars/2008/06/rising-gas-pric.html